Hosting fees idea?3623
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Viewing private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi all, I was having a think about hosting fees the other day after reading another thread. Problem: We don't know what to charge a client for hosting fees or how to charge it considering the variety of client types and requests. Solution: This requires community buy in to standardise consumer expectations, but all we need to do is add a little note on our prices to say *Hosting fee included. Nothing more than that is needed and we can set the hosting fee appropriately per client to cover a contracted length of hosting time. Nice and simple. |
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mcatino private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I think that is a great idea. But from reading allot and checking out pricing for services you all are going to kill yourselves with the lowball pricing for this Matterport services. I have been a professional photographer for 35 years and there is no professionalism here. Charging people .5 cents for 2000 sq ft ($100) is crazy and damaging to this industry. That is more of a problem than hosting charges. |
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Viewing private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @mcatino I completely agree with your sentiments there. Hosting fees is a tiny issue but it's an issue that people do think about so lets get it out of the way to focus on the bigger picture. It's not just hosting fees we need to standardise, it's tour prices. If you set the bar low from the get-go it's difficult to go back - but this is where we need to work as a community to reset consumer expectations. The very minimum people should be charging for a full tour of a regular property is $200-250. If we're smart, we can use 2017 as the year to reform the mistakes made regarding pricing. But we can only do it by working together. This is a quality product and we are professionals, let's try not to forget that. |
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mcatino private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I live in NJ where the cost of living is high and NYC is higher. Gas and auto insurance is also extremely high and my pricing has that figured in. I will not charge for travel unless it is out of state and includes air travel and hotel and other travel fees. Setting higher pricing allows me to lower my pricing as I see fit per client and situation. Having low prices advertise on the internet by other providers is the death to us all. I am speaking from 35 years of being a professional photographer. I fully understand that people that are getting into this field are not professional anything by estimation. This is not a slight on anyone just a observation and I am sure there are others like me. I have developed a baseline price structure under contract conditions only, my one time shoot costs are high to push them into a contract where the price goes down to .20 sq ft with a 1,500 sq ft minimum requirement that is $300 per photo shoot but even this .20 per sq.ft. is set to high quantity of jobs. If you are investing $4,000+ into this proprietary world you will go out of business sooner or later if you set prices to low. You all need to think of the total time invested into a job and I hope we can all come up with a standard. |
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Viewing private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Then we are on the same page. People new to the scene need to see the similarities with real estate photography and listen to people like yourself who have been there and done it. | ||
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Briski2208 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| There is a similar scenario manifesting within the drone industry. As individuals buy these products and the software becomes easier to use, the saturation of the industry becomes inevitable. I've seen professionals who fly drones charge £1000 a day, but have read on forums companies advertising for pilots who will gain £200 for a job taking up 1/2 a day. I think you have to be innovative and think outside the box, to offer a unique service and charging a realistic price, what represents the service you provide. It's same in any industry ie Ryanair or British Airways which one do you go for... | ||
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Regina, Saskatchewan Canada |
Queen_City_3D private msg quote post Address this user | |
| It is illegal to standardize pricing in any industry. USA has Antitrust laws that regulate fair competition. Canda has the Competition Bureau that does the same. UK also has Competition Laws. Admittedly Matterport photography scans would probably be way down on the list of targets for Government Anti-competition agencies... but I wouldn't want to find out. You must set your own pricing independent of anyone else. Each market will bear what it will bear. If another MSP undercuts your pricing to a level that is not sustainable for them, then just wait it out. You'll be there when they go broke. Otherwise, compete on customer service and other offerings and don't compete on price. |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't charge hosting. Why charge hosting? 1. We are scared of hitting our max scans in our hosting account and having to pay for a second account to support old scans. 2. We pay our monthly fees and do not use all of our free processing, thus we perceive that we are losing money because we're hosting. Thing is, we are paying a flat fee so it doesn't really matter. 3. We want to set boundaries with our clients thus charging hosting after 6 months protects us. 4. We like to make money and believe that residual income is key to being successful. So here's the thing. How much do people charge for hosting? If we charge proportionality to a maxed out $50/mo account, then it's $6/yr. (50*12/100). Let's add a service charge of $2 and make it $7.95/yr. Now how much did you charge for your scan? The hosting fee almost feels silly. If you have a great billing system like freshbooks.com, you can create a recurring bill at the time that you invoice, so factor in 10 minutes to set up each residual bill. OK. So what about a client who you work with on an ongoing basis. You are likely going to want to consolidate your billing to keep things simple. Customer service. Shoot. Rather than chase people over $8/yr, I would rather just scan something. 100 scans at $8/yr will net you $800 before processing fees... So $770? Don't get me wrong. I would love an extra $770. I think I am hosting 150 scans so for me it would cover my plan. But remember, your plan includes free processing which if fully utilized means that you are not even paying hosting in the first place. I might be mean, but I include "no hosting fees" as part of my marketing message and when Realtors or other potential clients call and ask, I tell them that it's a made up fee. I don't pay for hosting, so why would I charge them? I believe that AWS storage is only $0.03/GB. Most of our tours are a few hundred MB ... So let's say that Matterport pays 2.5 cents for hosting each of our tours on each CDN. They currently have two cdns. So let's just be crazy and say 6 cents per tour. I am sure that covers the cost of their stats integration too. 100 tours costs them six dollars per month. Am I wrong? So we are then charging clients 100x the actual cost of hosting their tour. I would like if matterport charged a $50/mo service contract with no free processing. A $100/mo package that includes 10 free tours, then $150 that includes 16 free tours, core VR, Matterport Studio, API access, etc. Matterport could increase that last plan to $179. I would pay it. More people would upgrade. Matterport leverage the # of collaborators as a price tier differentiator, so the software as a service structure seems respectable. The hosting limit is silly. GoDaddy realized that. It's about bandwidth and saas. Matterport can provide peace of mind and make more money. |
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Dana Point, CA |
RPOceanic private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't charge hosting fees as I consider it and include it in my fees and tell clients as much when asked. When I give a quote, I describe the entire process of a shoot start to finish so they can see the value in what we do... I explain that my prices include pre-scan survey/preparation of the property, scanning of the property, securing the property, processing, hosting and any needed post production. Giving an all inclusive cost to a client not only simplifies billing for me, but it creates a relationship where a client feels fully informed and eliminates the feeling of being nickel and dimed and fear of perpetual or possible surprise costs down the line. As to low ballers.... although initially concerning, as someone planning to be around long term, I see it as a short term threat. It IS an inevitability that their business will be short-lived. A business where confidence in the quality of your service is coupled with realistic, thoughtful long term assessment in pricing will win out in the long run and attract/inspire confidence in the kind of quality long term clients we all want a relationship with anyhow. |
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Regina, Saskatchewan Canada |
Queen_City_3D private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Metroplex360 I agree that hosting costs are greatly exaggerated. With a business plan paid annually your costs are $1499 USD/year, and Matterport will let you have up to 300 spaces hosted. Which means, if each space was filled and you didn't do any additional scanning you could assign a cost of $5.00/year to each model, or 42 cent/month. So, yes... the cost isn't that much.... UNLESS you have to give up your Matterport camera for whatever reason and the people who initially hired you have expectations that their model will last indefinitely. If you close shop, would Matterport still allow the model to remain? If not, there may be some major fallout. The majority of our scans are for real estate agents, and once those properties sell or the listings expire, they're probably fine to be off the internet. But what about businesses using the scans? My fear of not charging for hosting for long-term models is that it would bankrupt me having to keep a Matterport account open if and when we stopped offering the service. I assume I could find another MSP to take over the hosting for me, but I would think they'd want some compensation for having one of their hosting spots used up, even if it's only the 42 cents/month/model. Personally I feel that Matterport should reassure us all that hosting of models would be indefinite. I really feel they are missing out on a lot of camera sales from folks holding back out of fear that if they got in they couldn't afford to get out (because if they sold someone a long-term model they'd have to honour that commitment). Does that make sense? |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
@Queen_City_3D exactly! That's the problem! What if we want to stop offering Matterport services. I don't think the solution is sending 300 invoices per year to keep us floating  . I think Matterport might consider offering simple hosting with some Saas features for $5/yr per tour or something similar and allow us to transfer clients. They can credit our accounts a small kickback per tour. @Queen_City_3D Your thoughts totally line up with how I feel about the situation. |
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UserName private msg quote post Address this user | |
| My question as a home seller to my realtor might be, "You mean my home could be on the market for months?" | ||
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JonJ private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I think this is another case where cost should not dictate price. The price should be based on the perceived value. If Matterport decided to make floorplans free tomorrow, would you stop charging your clients for that service just because there is no cost to you? I would think that most of us would continue to charge a fee. For me, part of my business plan was to grow a portfolio of long term rentals and generate passive income via hosting fees. I charge $100 a year and have about 60 properties now. That's $6000 a year in passive income! Everyone should make their own decisions based on their business plan and their comfort level. Thanks, Jon |
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Viewing private msg quote post Address this user | |
| From all of that I'm thinking even the mention of hosting fees is over complicating the matter. It also made me realise that hosting fees could actually be a silent assassin for those undercharging. |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @JonJ dude, you rock. That's pretty fantastic passive income. I did not think that that would be possible. | ||
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mcatino private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I want to thank Bakter for starting this thread and Metroplex360, Queen City 3D,RPOceanic and Jon L for all their input. I am new here but a old hound dog in the photo business. I am in for the long haul. | ||
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 WGAN3rd Party Service Member Beijing |
JuMP private msg quote post Address this user | |
| My question: If someday you could host all the data on your website, would you charge to your client for the hosting? And how much it will be? Or you could just hand over all the result to your client and let them host it on their own website by charging a setup fee for just one time . Is it sound good? Or you like the matterport way now? |
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Viewing private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @JuMP I would imagine that Matterport's business model is based largely on recurring hosting fees so to stop charging hosting fees and hand the responsibility to us would be financial suicide for them. | ||
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kevshed private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I include hosting.. for all the reasons mentioned above, the reality is that this is not a material factor in my operating costs. Saying that... i do on my invoices, state that hosting is only included for the first year. Time will tell on whether i really ever go back and charge them again, and i don't mention it, and its not in my business plan to go chasing up hosting fees. Reason for this - is purely as future lead generation. If i don't hear from the client again, it means i have a valid reason to make contact about the 'renewal' and can use this as an opportunity to offer a 'model refresh' rather than just chase the pennies of hosting money. Whilst not applicable to real-estate discussions, i do think it would be helpful for the other commercial segments i target. Kev |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by JuMP I like that Matterport uses Amazon for CDN and has redundancy with fastly, ensuring the fastest speeds. I run a web hosting company and make residuals from clients, but I would not consider hosting Matterport tours as latency and connection speed are paramount. |
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Gransky private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I currently do not charge a hosting fee, but plan on it in the near future for certain clients, particularly condo/house rental clients. For rentals I plan on charging $XXX for the initial scan and 6 months of hosting. Then after 6 months, it's say $99 per year. With that hosting fee the client can request a room update. Say the client paints, changes the carpet, updates the appliances, etc. I haven't thought out all of the parameters, but it seems to be a reasonable way to make some residual income and provide a service to the client. I also think it would be reasonable stipulate in my contract that the price only includes one year of hosting for all of my clients. Whether or not I come back and charge is a different story, but it would probably be smart of me to add this. Never know what might happen a year from now. I don't currently have this provision. |
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 WGAN BasicMember New Brighton, PA |
frstbubble private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I don't have hosting fees per say. I have a licensing free. This is to use the product for a certain period of time for a certain use. A tv ad would be different than social media marketing and listing marketing. As for passive income, we have included in our business plan to try and get long term models to allow us to charge our yearly licensing fee. That will give us a recurring income that will cover our yearly operating costs. Remember there are three parts to pricing. Perception (value) + costs + risk. I think the last item risk is one thing a lot of you are talking about and that is the risk of long-term hosting of models no exit possible. That is why you have to have a licensing fee. Low ball pricing in not a sustainable business model. I point out in my presentations that our pricing provides for a sustainable business model and that the next time they want a product from us that we will be here. If they use a low ball person #1 they don't know what they are getting #2 next time they go to do it they will have to find a new low ball provider (because 1st one business model wasn't sustainable) and #3 they are back to #1 in not knowing what they are going to get... Additionally, we provide a "one stop shop" and I show the value for that and that we provide all this in one place on a landing page. And the very best selling point I think we have is the added value. We provide a complete package without a ton of add-ons. We incorporate them into the package price and promote it as all inclusive and a value they cannot get from anyone else. We do not focus on individual products but focus on selling a digital media marketing package. |
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