Transcript: Should I buy a Matterport Camera? If so, how to get Started?10019
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|WGAN-TV: Intro to Matterport for Professional Photographers with Matterport Representative Jonathan Buckley ( @Jwbuckl ) and Matterport Marketing Manager Amir Frank (Tuesday, 20 August 2019).
If you are a professional photographer thinking about adding Matterport 3D Tours to your service offering, you likely have a lot of questions about if and how to get started with Matterport.
The following is a transcript of the WGAN-TV Live at 5 show that aired Tuesday, 20 August 2019. My guests on the show:
✓ Matterport Marketing Manager Amir Frank
✓ Matterport Representative Jonathan Buckley ( @Jwbuckl )
I asked my guests to assume that I am a Pro photographer (photos, video, drone); I just heard about Matterport and I am wondering:
✓ should I buy a Matterport Pro2 3D Camera?
✓ if so, how should I get started.
- Hi all. I'm Dan Smigrod, Founder of the We Get Around Network Forum. Today is Tuesday, August 20th, 2019, and you're watching WGAN-TV Live at 5. Our topic tonight, Matterport 101. ... if you are a professional photographer and you're just thinking about getting started with Matterport, we got the exact right show, and the two exactly right guests today. Our first guest is Jonathan Buckley. Hey Jonathan, good to see you.
- Hi there.
- Jonathan is a Matterport Marketing Representative. And Amir Frank. Amir, good to have you on the show again.
- Good to see you again Dan.
- [Dan] Good to see you.
- Amir is a Matterport Content Marketing Manager. So for today's show, let's assume, Jonathan and Amir, let's assume that I'm a professional photographer, and one of my clients has mentioned something to me about Matterport.
I don't really know what it is. I just know that my client expressed some potential interest in Matterport, so I'm at the very beginning of researching Matterport as a potential add-on for my professional photography services.
I presently do DSLR, 2D photos, some video, aerial, and clients expressed this thing, I think they actually said, "Matterhorn," but I figured out it was Matterport that they were asking about. And I'm just really kind of deciding, I'm just really right at the beginning of my research, deciding like okay, what is this and should I add it as an Add-On, and if so, how do I get started?
So maybe, Jonathan, if I could start with you is, could you maybe give me an overview of what Matterport is? And again, let's take me out of the role of having a Matterport camera since July of 2014.
Let's assume I really have no knowledge, I've just started surfing the Web, and I'm lucky enough to talk to you. Could you just kind of bring me up to speed and overview of Matterport, maybe even include a demo in that too?
- Sure. Perhaps in the background we can have Amir, as I start to describe this, Amir can bring up a model as a fundamental background to this. But at its basics, Matterport, or Matterhorn, as some people mistakenly call it from time-to-time when they first hear the term, but Matterport is an immersive 3D platform.
That is a camera that works together with a full Cloud back-end platform, which produces an immersive 3D experience for viewers. And what is immersive 3D, or as Matterport has trademarked, True3D. This allows the viewer to walk through and experience a space as if they were there. Now this could be any type of space, for a variety of purposes.
And obviously the first, maybe not obvious to someone first being, experiencing Matterport, but one of the first large applications for this technology has been residential real estate, followed by commercial real estate.
But there are many other type vertical industries and use cases now, including insurance, architectural, engineering and construction, even yachts, and airplanes, and automobiles. But again, the theme is the same, when you want to experience the space as if you were there, to be able to navigate it, to walk through and turn, and move forward, backwards, floor-to-floor.
This is juxtaposed, to say, a 360 degree photograph, in which you stand in place and look around. Matterport does allow you to take 360 degree photographs through the platform, but there are plenty of other solutions in the market that simply allow you to take these 360 degree panoramas.
This is not true 3D. You're not walking through space as a function of time. You are standing in place. Hopefully this is a good description sort of to open up what Matterport is. Again--
- Yeah I think this is helping a lot, because I guess my perception was that a Virtual Tour, and I wasn't quite sure, you know, if that was a slideshow with music, and it was just another brand of slideshow plus music, or was it maybe 360s and I've seen that.
But this Matterport looks way different than a slideshow with music or just static 360s within the middle of a room.
- Absolutely. The term Virtual Tour gets applied to a lot of things, quite a variety of things, including plain old video that walks through, a video recorder that walks through a space, and then perhaps has music over-layed on top of it.
Immersive 3D is completely at the command of the viewer, using either a mouse or, for instance, a finger on an iPad or an iPhone, or some sort of mobile device, to allow the viewer at their pace, and at their demand, walk through the space, versus a video, which is at the recording devices demand to walk through the space.
- So what do you end up calling this? You don't call it a Virtual Tour? You call it immersive 3D?
- Immersive 3D or True3D, is something Matterport's called it. True3D is a trademark. But immersive 3D is something I call it being that you are immersed in the 3-dimensional space, in which you click. Yes.
- Amir, unless you wanted to show me something else, let's maybe come off the screen share. My real estate client that mentioned Matterport didn't really say too much, other than it was something that she was looking at.
Do you have any idea why, from her perspective, why she would want to have Matterport?
- Well, Matterport for real estate agents tends to set them apart from other real estate agents in their listings. Real estate agents tend to report that they win more listings using Matterport.
We've also done a series of studies, as a company, we've commissioned data scientists. We're in the middle of one right now, that show that properties listed with Matterport, with immersive 3D technologies, tend to sell for more money in less time. More specifically, one study that we're in the middle of right now indicates that, that time difference is 31% fewer days.
And we're currently showing in one market that we're studying, Austin, Texas, the first study was 18,000 homes. Our verification study on that, with 350 homes shows about 9.7% more. And the reason is, we think, the hypothesis is that you have many more people that have an opportunity to see the home as if they were walking through it. In other words, as if they were attending an open home.
You're able to walk through, and I put that in quotes, "walk through," a number of people, that a broker or an agent ordinarily wouldn't have been able to, and they're weeding themselves out.
So we have reports from different brokerages that claim they get as many as 50%, up to 50%, more qualified leads from listings that have Matterport as part of their listings. This is because people are self-filtering themselves. People that contact you after going through a 3D tour tend to be very interested in the property.
They're more. They're more in tuned to the property and what it has to offer because they're thoroughly through it by the time that they've contacted you and want to physically see the property.
- You mention a lot of statistics and I think I need to maybe go a little bit slower, and maybe you can help me, ... I mean the good news on this particular client is that she's expressed interest, but you know, I must say even for me just to take regular, two-dimensional pictures for this agent, sometimes is a struggle because she tells me the house is going to sell anyway, so sometimes it's really hard to get her to do aerial, or even video.
So if I go back to her, even with some study that says, "Hey, we're gonna sell the, "this Matterport True3D tour "will help you sell the house faster." I don't think she's gonna care about that because anything that she spends with me, comes out of her pocket, and she's often telling me, "I don't need that extra Add-On," of the aerial, or even the video, and even sometimes the photos, because the house is going to sell anyway. Is there anything you typically can tell an agent?
Maybe that just not the right statistic to be citing. I think you started to move on, before I move on was there something you wanted to comment on that.
- Yeah, so for an agent it's important to know that with Matterport, what agents report is that they win more listings when they align themselves with Matterport. Winning more listings is a big part of the game, for an agent.
So it's not just about whether the house is going to sell or not sell. It's about being able to win more listings. The second thing is, if your talking about if any of these studies are even remotely close--
- Is there a study, was there a study related to winning more listings? Is there something black and white to say, "Hey, if you use Matterport, you're gonna sell, "you're gonna get X percent more listings?"
- I don't have one actually at the tip of my tongue here, to quote from here. But this is something that's been widely reported back, through Matterport from its brokered users, and its agent users, throughout the Matterport family. But back to the point about selling for more, in less time.
You know, take a $500,000 house, for instance. A 9.7% uplift in the price of a home like that, say it was a $4,000, excuse me, a $400 Matterport scan, you're looking at something like a $1,600 dollar uplift to the broker's commission, the agent's commission, on a deal like that. It more than pays for itself, for something that also brings in extra listings.
- Well the challenge I have, even if it's not with this agent, is often the agents will say something like, "You know, not every listing sells."
So, you know, we never can control the homeowner of whether or not they may say, "Only if we get our price." And then they want more than what we've listed the house for. So if the house doesn't sell, the agent's still out the expense.
- Sure, it's a marketing expense. That's goes with anything. That even goes with 2D photographs, yes.
- Yes. She kind of looks at the photos as well, all her competitors are using professional photographers, so just to kind of stay even she feels that she still, begrudgingly still needs to engage me to shoot professional photography because every agent that's pitching a homeowner is pitching, "And we'll shoot professional photography."
Are there enough agents now using Matterport, that she's going feel compelled to use it because if she's not, someone else is pitching it?
- It depends on the market, Dan, but yes. At some markets there's 1% of the agents, in other markets there's up to 8% of the agents are using. I'm sure there's higher, I haven't seen it, but I'm sure there's some markets where there's a higher percentage of agents using it.
The question is, are you going for the lowest common denominator as an agent, or are you trying to build a book of business and a reputation based on having supreme marketing skills, and talents, and techniques, brought to bear? And Matterport goes into that bucket of things that shows that you're ahead of your game using modern techniques, and that you are staying ahead of the game.
- Let me ask the question a little bit differently, 'cause I always try to think about marketing as three things. One is why will the potential homeowner list their house with the agent? Two, why will the agent spend money with me to help the homeowner help the agent?
And then when I think about my business, I try to be first in service to the homeowner and to, who is ultimately my client, the real estate agent. So I think for the moment I still want to just stay focused on the agent.
Maybe that still means talking about the homeowner, but if we go back to the agent, I think Jonathan, one of the things you were talking about, one of the things you were talking about, was getting more money for the listing, and therefore, if you could actually get more money, that it would pay for itself. I'm just trying to think about the math, because in Atlanta the average house for sale is about $350,000. It's not 400, it's not 500, it's not a million.
So I'm just wondering, if there's a high enough potential return for the real estate agent, in order to spend additional dollars? So is there kind of a formula there, or that really, it's kind of up to, up to me with the agents, so I think, I think what I heard you say was, in the example that you gave, that if the house sold for an extra $1,600 ... and the agent had paid me $400 ... then that was kind of making double their money. Is that right? That's $400 with me, and maybe make close to $800 or $1,000?
- So they could maybe double, or a little bit more than double. Is there any sense of experience with other photographers, that they're able to help pitch Matterport True3D virtual tours to agents as a way to get more money for the listing?
- The typical way that Matterport photographers have pitched Matterport to agents has been on the winning more listings angle.
We are attempting, by bringing more data to bear, by looking the the so called Matterport effect, trying to bring in another angle for our photographers to bear, and that is, that is in fact the genesis of these studies that are now being run, that will be out and published by the end of this year.
- End of 2019. I think that this second piece of statistics you were quoting was about, as part of a study that's been done, that typically a listing that uses Matterport sells for more money than a listing that doesn't, if I heard that correctly.
- Correct, yes.
- Okay. And you were talking about faster, which, the listing selling faster. I'm not sure that mattered to me. It might matter to the homeowner, but you know, in some markets that are hot, Atlanta seems to be a pretty hot market, it's one of those the listing's going to sell regardless. So I think one of the things you were talking about, excuse me, was leads. Is there something statistically about a agent that uses Matterport is on average going to get X percent more leads than they normally, 'Cause my agent does care about leads.
- Yeah, there have been various reports from different agents and different brokerages about leads that they've received. You can check on matterport.com under the real estate section. That report, this Matterport effect, from leads.
Also with apartments, as well. For instance apartments.com reports 49% greater lead flow, as a result of using Matterport in the apartment segment. So not just in real estate listings, but also in apartment listings, as another example. So there is an effect that immersive 3D has on various segments, over just having 2D, still photography, or video only on websites.
- One of the things I was, had some angst about, you mention that potential homeowners, let's say home buyers, looking at Matterport may screen out say, "Oh, don't need to visit that house, "it's not for me, I can immediately tell."
Do you have any experience with agents, where agents push back on that? Because it seems like they want , excuse me. I often have this sense that my agent really doesn't care about whether that person's buying the house or not, they just really want to spend time with that person who's looking at the house, maybe looking at their listing, because the more time that they spend together, might be that they pick up a good lead.
So is this, I don't know how to ask the question, for every lead that they don't get, do they end up getting more leads because they did use Matterport?
- Right, I think I understand your question. This is a philosophical difference. There are agents, you know, I've been in marketing and sales my whole career.
I see this philosophical difference in many different industries. Some people want to see any and all names that might flow through, see if there is any remote possibility whatsoever. Other philosophies are let the technology do the qualification, as much as possible, and let me see the most qualified lists as possible, to make my time as valuable as possible. Matterport is for the latter crowd.
The idea is that folks that are looking at your website and doing 3D tours are self-selecting themselves out. The 2D photography might have the kitchen look big and expansive, for instance. But when they're in the 3D tour it might give them a more realistic picture of what it looked like.
You might actually be, you might have actually had to do a roll out to the home to do a whole tour, only to find out that very same thing.
The kitchen's too small and this wasn't the right home for that family. Whereas the 3D tour could have helped self-select out that property. One philosophy is, you know, it was a waste to meet with that family.
The other philosophy is, maybe I can turn them on to another property. So it depends how you want to run your business. Personally, if my goal is to sell a home, I want to meet those that have selected themselves in, as quickly as possible on the property that I'm trying to sell. Sell what's on the truck.
- Yeah I think for me, in terms of helping , excuse me, in terms of helping our clients, the things that I see for our agent are can I help the agent get more leads, because someone sees her listings with our photography and says, "Oh, that agent, "I can tell they've hired a really terrific photographer, "That's something for me." Can I help the agent from those leads get more listing presentations? I'm giving you the things that are important to me, to my agent.
Maybe you can work with this and tell me your thoughts on it. So can I, from those leads for the agent, is to get the agent more listing presentations? She's a home seller agent. And then from those listing presentations, can she actually win more of the listing presentations?
And then ultimately, I'd like to be able to see our client trade up to get bigger listings, bigger premium listings. Not bigger in size, necessarily, but houses that sell for more money, knowing that for me she'd have more money to spend with me 'cause she's doing bigger premium listings.
To some extent she's interested in being a little bit forward thinking and tech savvy, and I think that's true of some of our younger agents. I hate that it's an age thing, but I tend to see that our younger agents, clients, tend to gravitate more towards technology. Of the things that I have said, do any of those resonate as far as Matterport checking the box to help an agent?
- Yeah. Yes, they do. Winning more, winning more listings from the same agent, moving up property classes, that does ring a bell. Yeah, and resonates well with what we see.
- And is this, and maybe it's the question for Amir I notice you've been with Matterport I think three, almost four years you've been there.
- ... three and a half years.
- Three and a half years, in a variety of roles that probably have put in close, in touch, close conversations with photographers. Is Matterport, is it hard to shoot? Is there much in the way of post-production?
- It's not difficult to shoot. It certainly doesn't require, you know, a steep learning curve. It is very much automated, but there is still some things that you're gonna want to do to kind of come out with the best scan possible. Right, so.
- How many houses do I have to shoot before I feel like I know what I'm doing?
- I would say, if you're looking at pretty much just doing real estate, a handful of houses and you're set. There isn't really that much difference between the two. If you're jumping verticals and doing, you know, insurance, then that's going to be a slightly different set of skills, do things a little bit differently.
And again, another one or two scans there and you've got that taken care of. Same thing with AEC and construction, larger spaces, open, large rooms, requires maybe things like AprilTags to do some more visual alignment. But again, you do a couple scans there and it's, you're good to go.
- Most of our bread and butter is residential and commercial real estate. I'd love to see if we could grow our photography business in some other categories. But really, for the moment, if I decide to pull the trigger and get Matterport, initially it would be because I think I have a client that would be my initial client for it. So I'm just kind of wondering, you know, if I shoot three houses do I feel like I've mastered it? Do I need to shoot 10? Does it take me 100 before I actually have proficiency in it?
- I would say between two and five and you should be proficient. Like with any skill, the more you do it the better you get at it.
The more you come prepared to the house, you can more quickly walk through the house, make sure everything's as it should be before you even get started. You become more efficient the more you do it. Again, like with any skill.
- Our typical listing for this agent, 3,500 ... 4,000 square feet. Does this take a full day to shoot? How long does this take to do this?
- So with something like the Pro2, I would estimate about 40ish minutes per 1,000 square feet.
- So 3,000 square foot home, I'm not sure I can do the math, but that would be...
- You're looking at about two hours and 10, 15 minutes. Two hours to two hours and 15 minutes.
- Plus some setup time, I guess, in addition to that or are you factoring setup time?
- No, that pretty much factors in the setup time. The setup isn't too bad. Setting up the camera's a one button push ....
- And my agent wants everything immediately. Does this take like a week to turn around, or, it looked pretty complex? How long does it take from the time I shoot it to the time I can deliver it to the client?
- So once you're done shooting, all the model data is located on your iPad. You can, if you have a cell network you can, even on your way back to the office, begin uploading. I don't personally feel that's necessary.
Once you get it back to your home or office, hook up the wi-fi, send all your data to your account. And it can take, again it's completely depends on several factors, so there's no way of gaging a precise ETA, but up to eight hours with a very typical scan, if you're doing like you said, 4,000 square feet. But really, really large spaces can potentially take longer.
- I'm still not sure I understand. So if my listing is 4,000 square feet, I get back to my house or my office, we have high speed Internet in both locations.
- I upload it, how long is it how long is it gonna take to upload, and will it be ready in the morning?
- I would say 4,000 square feet is gonna take you about 150-170 scan positions. So with something like the Pro2, you're looking at between three and three and a half gigabytes of information. How long is that gonna take?
Again, it totally depends on your Internet connections, but like you said you have a pretty fast connection. I'm guessing shouldn't take more than 10, 15 minutes, right?
- It might be faster for us. We're lucky enough to have home and office with like, I think it's like gigabyte service, or something.
- That's great ....
- About 750 up and down. Most of the time, so.
- You are very fortunate then.
- So that's not gonna slow me up
- that's not a time factor right there. Then once it's up in your account, it is churning through a processing engine that's completely automated, so it can take anywhere between half an hour, for a few scans, up to eight hours for something like a 4,000 square foot place.
- So if I'm doing a house, it's gonna be ready, typically ready, in the morning? When I wake up, it's gonna be ready?
- Oh for sure, absolutely.
- Okay. And can I deliver it to the client as is, or do I need to then do something?
- That is kind of between you and your client. It is ready to go. As it's processing, we generate SnapShots for you, so we already capture a lot of images that the machine feels are good pictures that you would want to use in marketing, advertising.
If they're not, you can certainly go in and take whatever SnapShots that you want, you know, that better suits your needs, as well as short video clips that can be used as teasers and different things like Instagram, Facebook, and so on that can link back to the entire model. So a lot of assets are created for you, that you can just deliver right away, as soon as it's done.
- And are other photographers charging for those other assets, or are they just delivering the Matterport space and their DSLR images?
- It really varies. But it completely depends on whether you're a photographer that is going to host the model, and sell that to the agent directly, so your client is the agent.
Or is your client really the broker, who has an account themselves, and you're just uploading to their account? At which point, they should probably be trained up on things like Workshop so they can do minor edits. But once they've paid you to do the scanning process, it's really their asset and they can do with it what they want, and your hands are free.
- I saw that you did this series on WGAN-TV Live at 5 where you did five days of training for Matterport Workshop 3.0. I haven't had a chance to watch that show. I understand I can go back into the WGAN Forum and see that. That seems like a lot of time, just to train on Workshop, is there a lot of post-production to do, or is this truly I either can deliver it as is, or I can trick-it-out as much as I want?
- It's up to you, as, you know, between you and your client. So it doesn't have to be a lot of post-production work. It can be very simple. It can be a matter of just pulling a couple images, whether, if you feel like the ones that are automatically captured are good enough, that's great.
Throw them on a highlight reel, and you're done. You can then take it a step further if you'd like, add some MatterTags, with potentially embedded images, so close-ups of things like granite countertops, fireplace, so on and so forth, and just highlight those aspects of the home, for example.
- Can I charge more money for all this stuff you're describing? The agent's pay? You know, I have real estate agents that just, I mean, like the agent that's kind of sending me to think about Matterport, she's kind of tight on dollars, so the things that you're talking about, are these optional extra Add-Ons, or do some of your photographers include them when they deliver, or do some photographers don't do any of this and just deliver the basic Matterport tour?
- It spreads all of that, so it just depends, and you as a business owner can decide, "Look, I'm gonna "do the scan for X number of dollars, and if you'd like "to get an extra Add-On where I go in and really jazz it up 'for you, it'll be, I don't know, another Y dollars," you know, $100, for whatever.
However much, you know, you feel is necessary. But yeah, so it's also gonna change, I'm guessing, between the different areas. And, you know, if you're in Atlanta, and houses sell without a problem, then yeah, you're agent, maybe for them it's not worth it to have MatterTags highlighting aspects of the home, and which case, why bother putting them in there?
- I'm guessing that the only reason to bother is if, as Jonathan said, I can maybe have the agent think about Matterport, not as a tool to sell the house that we've scanned, but as the tool to get the next listing.
- [Amir] Right.
- I think there's a big difference there for the agent who already who has already gotten the listing. They typically want to spend the least amount of money, but if I can get the agents thinking about how they're gonna use aerial, or video, or whatever, Matterport True3D virtual tours, to get the next listing, that, I think, is where it really becomes exciting because that's where my client's got money to spend.
- [Amir] Right.
- You know, Jonathan, I heard Amir mention an iPad, I imagine I need a tripod, so I need an iPad, a tripod, the camera, what else do I need to do this?
- You need a clamp for the top of your tripod, that fits, that specifically fits the camera itself. You have camera selection that you make. There are several different cameras that you could use. Our Pro2 camera is--
- Are there some pictures? Amir was sharing that tour, maybe he's got some pictures of cameras. I just barely glanced and noticed there were some different choices of cameras, so I was a bit confused 'cause I saw a camera that was under $400, another camera that was under $500, another camera that was under $1,000, I think there was one for under $3,500, then there was one, I think, that was under $20,000.
No way I'm gonna spend $20,000 on my real estate agent's listings. So, can you, I'm kind of inclined to get started, kind of my bias I figure I got at least one client that's got some interest, but you're showing me five cameras on the screen here. Which one is right for me?
- Sure, well the Pro photographer, the professional photographer, is probably most inclined to go with the Matterport Pro2 3D camera, which is our, is our Pro offering. This one is at $3,395. This has depth sensors built into it, it's 4k, 134 megapixel camera. It's got three sensors built into it. This can do depth measurements and has accuracy up to about 1% accuracy. This is the workhorse of the group. You are seeing, just so I, yes Dan? I think you said something?
- No no, I'm sorry Jonathan, please go on.
- Yeah, you're seeing the Leica, the Leica Geosystems BLK360 listed here. This is a specialty camera for high precision, very large spaces, very bright spaces, but a price tag close to $19,000. So not something, you know, run of the mill. Definitely a specialty piece of camera.
- Well I'm gonna rule that one out. I am curious, like, you know, can I just spend $400 and call it a day? What's the difference between the three cameras on the left, compared to the $3,400 Matterport Pro2 3D camera?
- Okay, the three cameras on the 360 entry-level side, and the Pro2 Camera, what sets them apart, number one, they don't have depth sensors in them.
They're spherical cameras, so their accuracy is going to be limited to about, within 4-8%, versus the 1%, so you're not going to be driving floor plans, for instance, out of the MatterPak offering that we have. There is a limit to clarity, the clarity of image your going to be able to get out of them. For instance, the highest rated one, in terms of image quality here, the Ricoh Theta Z1, at about $1,000, is a 23 megapixel camera, right? There's only so much you're gonna get out of 23 megapixels, up against 134 megapixel camera like the Matterport Pro2.
- So is the tour that Matterport 3D True3D virtual tour created with the Ricoh Theta Z1 compared to a virtual tour created with the Matterport Pro2 3D camera, will my client be able to tell the difference?
- Your client will be able to tell the difference, yes. Side-by-side there is a difference, that you can tell. Where,
- Good enough? I don't always, necessarily, you know, I'm a business person more than I am an artist, so from a business perspective can I spend $1,000 and get something that's good enough to produce the results, or are those entry-level really, truly entry-level and more of a hobbyist, enthusiast, or if I just wanted to experiment and play with Matterport before I actually spent some serious money?
- To experiment and play with it before you spend some serious money, absolutely. To give you an idea, we don't allow the entry-level 360 cameras into our Matterport Service Partner program.
In other words, if you're shooting professionally for Matterport, you have to use the Pro2 or the Leica BLK360. I tell you what though, the 360 cameras are excellent for certain use cases like small spaces, perhaps shooting in mixed environments together with the Pro2. For instance, automobiles, inside an auto dealership, airplanes, you know, aircraft like I was saying, yachts, and other--
- I don't have any yachts in Atlanta.
- No, no, but you do have plenty of airplanes, you have small spaces, apartment rentals, things like Airbnbs, or the like, you know.
- Most of, most of our business is shooting residential, maybe 80% residential, 20% commercial. I don't see us doing any cars, or boats, or planes. So if I'm going to do this as a business Add-On for our photography service, you would recommend the Pro2 3D camera?
- Absolutely, yes.
- Okay. And then you mention something about, I think I heard it was a Matterport Service...
- [Dan] Partner, what's that?
- MSPs are partners of Matterport, which are, they have a designated badge--
- I'm sorry, could you take it off the screen share? I'm good on looking at the cameras.
- You got it. One second.
- Thank you.
- You're welcome. These are Matterport partners, which are aligned with Matterport where we, when we get requests for professional photographers, we send out these requests to this partner network. There's about 4,500 of these MSPs worldwide, at this moment, across 100 countries.
- So will you be sending me leads?
- That's correct, yes, the company sends leads through. Right now when we receive a request in a service area, say it's the greater Denver area--
- Atlanta, I'm in Atlanta.
- You're in Atlanta. If you're in the Atlanta area there's probably other MSPs like you. We route that need to, in accordance to a, an algorithm, which routes it to the nearest three MSPs, at the same time. And so the three MSPs closest to that lead receive that MSP request.
- [Jonathan] Yes.
- Is it, are there enough leads for me to make a decision to buy the camera and everything else I need because I'm gonna get enough leads? Or I should really evaluate this based on my existing business and can I use Matterport as an Add-On for my existing and potential clients?
- Think of Matterport as an Add-On to your existing clients, and think of Matterport's leads as a bonus. We're doing a webinar on this very topic, on Sept. 11 2019, about this very topic, we're touching on this very topic.
But I don't see enough lead flow, in and of itself, to support a camera purchase, in and of itself, from the find-a-photographer leads, but they're definitely an Add-On bonus, to the business that you're doing already, or would be doing already.
- In terms of other things I need, Amir mentioned something about a cloud, so do I need a raincoat, do I need a...
- No, that's just where your account sits online. Really the only accessories you're gonna need are the camera, and outside of the camera nothing comes with it from Matterport, so you'll need to invest in a tripod if you don't already have one. The tripod should not have a head on it, so if you are a photographer and you use a ball head or a pan tilt head with your system, take it off. As Jonathan mentioned, just use a clamp only. We really want to have that system to be as solid and steady as possibly. You've got a camera that's turning around, and it's not a light weight camera, so...
- Okay, and is that--
- So a tripod, clamp, camera, and iPad or iPhone.
- Is there something on your desktop you're showing us there, Jonathan?
- I'm bringing up the, bringing up the cloud option, so I think that's where you were going, Dan.
- Yes please, thank you. So how much to get started? So it doesn't cost me anything to get started? That says entry-level, okay, I gotta get the Pro camera for what I'm doing, so it looks like the first plan, entry-level would be $69 a month for me?
- Yes, should you have one of the 360 cameras already, feel free to attach it to Matterport under a free account, and try Matterport out for free. So a Theta V, or a Insta360 One X, or if you happen to have a Theta Z1, you can do that for free. Likewise, from there you can move up to a starter program.
But if you are starting out with a Pro2, you would start with the Professional plan, which starts at $69 a month. It's compatible with all the cameras, but in this case we're talking about the Pro2. You can have five users and up to 25 active models, and an unlimited number of total models. So in other words, you could have 1,000 models, but 25 of them active, meaning that they're alive, viewable, shareable, and active on the Web.
- Okay, cool. I don't see anything in here about processing, or anything. It's just, it's $69 a month and I can upload an unlimited number of tours and it's just based on a cap of up to 25.
- That's correct.
- I immediately jump to $129/month when I have 26 active models?
- That's correct. And we used to have an older pricing model, that used to have additional charges, in addition to what used to be $49 a month at the Starter rate. Used to charge extra for processing a model. Used to charge extra for things like large spaces or anything with more than 100 scans per model. Perhaps that large house example we talked about earlier, where Amir thought there would be 170 scans, would be considered a large model. Those go away under this plan in an attempt to make it simpler and more easily budgeted. So $69 covers it all. If you're uploading an processing dozens of models, and if they're all large, it doesn't matter, it's still $69 a month.
- Can you take it off screen share? I get it in terms of numbers, it seems pretty straightforward, but I think I need to go create a little spreadsheet and figure out how many of these I could do. Is there any guidance on price? I think I heard you mention something about $400 in an example. Do you have any thoughts on what photographers are actually getting in a market like Atlanta?
- This is something we're covering on September 11th's webinar, again. But sneak peak is, we've done a survey of our MSPs and it looks like the average in the United States, in the residential market is right around 10 cents a square foot, for your average size home.
There are markets where there have been MSPs that have swamped out the market, where photographers have gone for the so called $99 specials. There's some regions in say, Florida and Michigan, where we've seen this. This is not typical, this is where the rates are very, very low. For the most part, you know, 10 cents plus or minus three cents is about where people are tending to price these things, if you were to come up with a, with a, you know, good model.
- Okay so, for the purpose of me putting together a little pro forma budget, I might start with ten cents a square foot. Knowing that my average listing is 3,500, 4,000 square feet, so we're talking about $350 ... $400 dollars. I guess I just have to figure out if I can get clients to say yes to that.
I think, if I heard correctly, the components of cost was the Matterport Pro2 3D Camera, tripod I got, little clamp to attach the camera to the tripod, I get it, that's not gonna be too much. I need an iPad, I guess I could use one of my existing iPads, any reason?
- No, you can use one of your existing as long as it's, I would say, ideally the iPad 6, 6th generation iPad or better. Any of the iPad Pros is great, iPad Airs are good, 6th generation.
- Is the most recent iPads, does that effect how fast it scans, or how fast something happens?
- Not scans, but how fast it processes. So it can figure out the alignment between the scan positions faster with a faster, stronger iPad, which allows you to move on to the next quicker. So the most current iPad is going to help me run as fast as I possibly can through a house.
So if I'm doing any volume at all, it's gonna make sense to be on whatever the most current version of an iPad Pro is.
- Ideally, yeah.
- Okay, got it. Camera come with a case?
- Camera comes with a really nice amount of foam, in a cardboard case with a nice handle, kind of like a suitcase. Definitely seen people use that--
- [Dan] I got to buy a case, I get it.
- If you're gonna be doing some traveling, recommended to get a Pelican™ case, yeah, hard case. Okay, I'll look at a case. I imagine if I'm scanning all day my iPad may run out of juice. Do I need a battery to keep charging my iPad while I'm scanning?
- iPad batteries last pretty long, but it's definitely a good idea to have a backup. Yeah, any external battery pack that you can just USB right into the iPad, you can even have it charging as you're using it.
- Okay. And then the Pro2, how long does that last before need to charge it?
- About eight hours, so it should go all day. And you just charge it overnight.
- If I was lucky enough to do three scans in one day, and have a $1,200 day, if that's what it averaged out, at about two and a half hours a house, two, four, six, seven and a half, so sounds like I'd be okay for doing three listing if I had to.
And maybe if I was having lunch, charge it while I was at lunch. Go fight over that power outlet at Starbucks.
- [Amir] Exactly.
- So I can be charging. Well, actually I think I'd probably get one of those power converter boxes, I think their about 25 bucks. Plug it into my cigarette lighter, and I think while I'm driving between jobs I can be charging up the camera.
- [Amir] That's exactly. Okay well, you know I was thinking about, based on, you know, Amir, what you've said, Jonathan what you've talked about, I think I'm close to pulling the trigger. Today's Tuesday August 20th, 2019, I heard I should probably wait until September 11th, 2019. Is that an event that I can go to, or was that for your Matterport Service...?
- Oh, it's an event. We'll make sure that, Dan, you know about it, and everyone on WGAN knows about it, we just haven't announced it yet.
It's how to build a thriving 3D photography business, actionable insights from our top MSPs. We've done a series of four studies based on our top MSPs, you know, what their marketing behavior, marketing and sales behaviors have been.
Everything from website design to different closure rates, what their closure rates have been, and that sort of thing. So we've found that there's some good bit of data in there that I think everyone will take something good away from it.
- Terrific. Okay, when I'm ready to buy, and I think I'm pretty close to pulling the trigger, probably be the day after September 11th, and, is there any, do I need to talk to somebody to buy it? Do I go to a website to buy? How do I actually go buy the camera and the Matterport Cloud account?
- Well, you can go to matterport.com and click on the Buy button, up top. There's also an 800 number, which you can also find on the site if you feel more comfortable talking to somebody through the whole process, which is more than acceptable. We have a number set up in the US and in multiple countries, you will see the numbers also set up on the site.
- You know I do have some photography friends all around the globe. Is it the same process for them? Do they go to matterport.com, or are there 800 numbers in London, Melbourne?
- Yes, there are numbers in different places around the globe, you'll see those set up on the site. Or, alternatively--
- Amir, could you show me what page I would go to, to actually buy the camera and the Cloud account? ... So maybe if you could start on matterport.com? You know I always have some concern about, you know, buying something and then in like the next day, the next generation camera comes out.
Are you all working on a Matterport Pro3 3D Camera, and as soon as I buy my Pro2 gonna be surprised that a new camera just comes out?
- Further foundational work is being done, but it's gonna be a long time. It's like waiting for any technology, Dan, even with Canon and Nikon cameras, every year their gonna come out with the new ones, where you're gonna wait another year to get the latest and greatest, right? It's more about the business, and what's best to get that going, so I'd say don't wait, it's gonna be a long time.
- Long time. Okay, so I see that you're on matterport.com, there's a button up in the top right that says shop. So I go there and then
- there's a 800 number here, by the way. Shop button up here.
- How did I find the 800 number?
- It's right at the top.
- Okay, and then now you've clicked on that Shop button, and on the left it says subscription plans and cameras.
- Yep, right here so--
- Click on that to see pricing and order now.
- That'll take you to your ....
- Here's the Pro2 for $3,400, and so then I just click on that button to increase the number for my shopping cart, and then click on the professional, $69 a month.
- So like this one, here is where you would select whether you want the 25 or 50 active.
- Yeah, I'd just start with 25. When I get 26 I'll know that I need to upgrade. Then I just go down to add to cart, is it that easy?
- It's that easy.
- That easy. Monthly subscription.
- [Amir] Down here at the bottom.
- Okay, and so, and then if I go ahead and I complete this purchase, and in two weeks decide that this is just not for me, I didn't like the process of how scanning works, or something, can I send it back?
- Absolutely, we have a 30 day money back guarantee. You will get the $3,400 dollars for the camera back, unfortunately, that will not be the same for the Cloud.
- Okay, whatever I spent monthly, I don't get that back. And then I see in the bottom right there, a Help button. Is that to talk to somebody?
- Yeah, so this you can use, hang on a second, I've got a little thing in the way. So you can use this to ask some questions regarding any questions that you may have.
- Okay, and then Jonathan mentioned some 800 numbers, if I really want to talk to somebody, where do I find them on this page?
- Good question, on this page.
- What, I'm sorry, Dan, what was the question?
- Where are all the 800 numbers, if I decide I don't want to do this live chat?
- Yeah, so in the help, it's not just a kind of a look up for your question, but if you don't find your question once you've asked it, there is a live chat option that you can chat with--
- Yeah, but if I don't want to do the live chat online?
- You don't want to do the live chat and you'd rather go.
- [Dan] Is there some phone numbers to talk to someone?
- Yeah, so if you go back here, this should know my location in the world, and present--
- ... okay, so my friends in London, in Melbourne, in Paris, if they go to the website then it's gonna show the appropriate number for them in their area?
- And then presumably, is the live chat in the appropriate language where they are?
- It depends, the live chat right now we've got a few, and I don't see any numbers at the bottom. I was hoping we could have some numbers regardless of your location at the bottom, but they're not there.
So yeah, as far as the live chat, we have out of our London location, our UK team, has German, Spanish, and French covered. And here in the US we have, I believe mostly just English and Spanish covered.
- Okay great, you can take it off screen share that would be great. So thank you very much, I'll come out of character of someone who doesn't have a Matterport camera, but has been thinking about getting one.
So, thanks so much Jonathan and Amir, what would the word be? Entertaining my desire to go into theater I suppose, I don't know. Before we wrap up, Jonathan, anything to add?
- No, I think we just about covered it. ... there are plenty of reasons for a photographer to add this to their book of business already.
Our photographer's reports, the majority report that this adds more revenue for clients, on average. It's a new tool that's growing quickly and should add great deal of interest to your client base, and that's something to consider.
- Amir, anything to add?
- No, that pretty much does it.
- Terrific, so Jonathan, thanks so much for being on the show today. I appreciate it. Jonathan Buckely is a Matterport Marketing Representative. Amir, thank you for being on the show today.
- My pleasure, thank you so much Dan. = Amir Frank is a Matterport Content Marketing Manager, and you all, where are right today?
- Sunnyvale, California.
- Sunnyvale, and I'm in Atlanta, Georgia. So if you've missed any portion of today's show, as we do for all our WGAN-TV Live at 5 shows, we do record them and we do place them in the We Get Around Network forum the next day.
If you're watching us on our YouTube channel or many other places you can actually watch WGAN-TV, I invite you to the We Get Around Network Forum, WeGetAroundNetworkForum.com or WGANForum.com, and feel free to ask questions, Jonathan I know is a member of the We Get Around Network Forum, thank you, and is always happy to answer questions, as well as other members of the community.
Jonathan, thanks again. Amir, thanks again. And I'm Dan Smigrod, Founder of the We Get Around Network Forum for WGAN-TV, thanks for tuning in.
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