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GeoCVLawLegalPatents

It's on: Matterport Sues GeoCV8019

Premium
Member
Jamie private msg quote post Address this user
Matterport sues geocv

clickable text

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.inman.com/2018/10/12/matterport-sues-rival-geocv-in-3d-home-tour-showdown/amp/
Post 1 IP   flag post
zsolt private msg quote post Address this user
It's like Canon sues Nikon because their camera producing digital photos. But here the result same but the technology different
Post 2 IP   flag post
Standard
Member
Home3D private msg quote post Address this user
Is the GeoCV tech different, or is it patent infringement? That's what the lawsuit and its "expert witnesses" will have to decide. This is why patents exist, and from this we'll learn just how different the tech is and how well defined Matterport's patents are.

If you're old enough to remember, Polaroid developed "instant photography" and a few years later Kodak released their own version, a bit less expensive. Kodak's tech gained customers due to lower cost. In time, Polaroid sued for patent infringement and won its case. Kodak's entire instant photo division closed its doors.

Interesting to remember because at the time, although Polaroid was very successful, it was a "David" to Kodak's "Goliath" from a financial ammunition standpoint. Goliath lost. Patents do work if well written. This could be an interesting battle.
Post 3 IP   flag post
June private msg quote post Address this user
😳 yes it should be interesting to see how this pans out.
Post 4 IP   flag post
Standard
Member
3SixtyNow private msg quote post Address this user
I wish I could read the article without being an Inman subscriber!! I searched online but everything leads back to Inman.
Post 5 IP   flag post
GeoCV
Co-Founder
AntonYakubenko private msg quote post Address this user
Dear community,

I've been always transparent and responsive on this forum. I would be happy to tell you what's happening behind the scenes with this Matterport complaint but I’m concerned that what I say to you could be misinterpreted and used against us. So I'd like to just assure you that GeoCV is confident in its position as we have spent years and millions dollars of R&D for developing our proprietary solution. GeoCV has its own intellectual property, and GeoCV respects others’ intellectual property. GeoCV will vigorously defend itself against any of Matterport’s claims.
Post 6 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@Jamie

Thanks for posting.

@zsolt

Yup!

@Home3D

Yes. David v Goliath

@June

'Pans' out. That would be a pun

@3SixtyNow

Try an incognito search for "Matterport sues rival GeoCV in 3D home tour showdown" ...

@AntonYakubenko

We look forward to hearing from you when this case is behind you.

Hi All,

I could imagine that this lawsuit will settle before trial. GeoCV will pay some small - undisclosed - licensing amount. And, Matterport will be able to say it has defended its patents and put others on notice.

If Matterport does go to trial, I could imagine that Matterport will lose some or all of their patents. @AntonYakubenk - Co-Founder and CEO of GeoCV - is a super-smart tech executive whom I believe would not have invested years and millions of dollars on R&D to develop their own proprietary tech if they thought that they would lose.

I could imagine that Matterport does NOT have a good case to defend its dollhouse view and would not want to risk losing that patent.

So, all sides settle.

In the mean time, Matterport does GeoCV a huge favor by generating a ton of trade press coverage: essentially elevating GeoCV's status and a major player (worth the time and expense of legal action).

And, with the settlement comes an influx of millions of dollars of venture capital to GeoCV to fill its sail to help take the company from a New Year City area tour creator to a national player.

For Service Providers, this legal tif is great news. More real estate agents will become aware of 3D Tours.

Stay tuned. Exciting times ahead.

Best,

Dan
Post 7 IP   flag post
Photo - Video
Editing Service
PhotoAndVideoEdits private msg quote post Address this user
Assuming Antons Technology is completely different to Matterport's technolodgy, how can they win?

Is Matterport saying that they have figured out how to get into space away from earths gravitational pull by making a rocket fueled my hydrogen and oxygen and they put a patent on how to get into space? So they are claiming infringement because no-one else is allowed to design another rocket even if fueled by a completely different propulsion system because it will get you into space?
Post 8 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user

Video: #ICNY18 Matterport CEO Bill Brown / GeoCV Co-Founder / CEO/Co-Founder Anton Yakubenko

Hi All,

Some irony that Matterport CEO Bill Brown and GeoCV Co-Founder and CEO Anton Yakubenko shared the stage at Inman Connect New York 2018 in June 2018.

Best,

Dan

P.S. Quote:
Originally Posted by @PhotoAndVideoEdits
Assuming Antons Technology is completely different to Matterport's technolodgy, how can they win?

Is Matterport saying that they have figured out how to get into space away from earths gravitational pull by making a rocket fueled my hydrogen and oxygen and they put a patent on how to get into space? So they are claiming infringement because no-one else is allowed to design another rocket even if fueled by a completely different propulsion system because it will get you into space?


Yes. Space is limited to one rocket company
Post 9 IP   flag post
Photo - Video
Editing Service
PhotoAndVideoEdits private msg quote post Address this user
I think maybe some of you agree that Matterport comes across as greedy and "I want it all" just like they would like every customer that has used a MSP to buy their own camera. I simply cant imagine Tesla putting a patent on the first massed produced fully electric car and saying that no other major manufacturer can make electric cars.
Post 10 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by @PhotoAndVideoEdits
I think maybe some of you agree that Matterport comes across as greedy and "I want it all" just like they would like every customer that has used a MSP to buy their own camera. I simply cant imagine Tesla putting a patent on the first massed produced fully electric car and saying that no other major manufacturer can make electric cars.


Yes. Electric cars are limited to one car company
Post 11 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user

Video: #ICNY18 Matterport CEO Bill Brown / GeoCV Co-Founder / CEO/Co-Founder Anton Yakubenko

Hi All,

About the video I shared (above), check out 40:29 into the video for my commentary about the similarity of the Matterport and GeoCV dollhouse view demoed on stage at Inman Connect.

Best,

Dan
Post 12 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user

WGAN-TV: Matterport versus GeoCV with GeoCV CEO and Co-Founder Anton Yakubenko, PhD

Hi All,

What is GeoCV and why do they 'matter'?

GeoCV Co-Founder and CEO @AntonYakubenko was my guest in June (2018) on WGAN-TV Live at 5 shortly before the 2018 Inman Connect conference in New York City.

In this 2-hour show, Anton and and I discuss Matterport versus GeoCV.

Best,

Dan

P.S. All WGAN Forum discussions tagged: GeoCV
Post 13 IP   flag post
June private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks Dan for the info. I have never heard of GeoCV so I agree that this will propel them in the market. I really liked what I saw on their website. The ends results are great. I don’t however understand why Matterport would sue them because it appears their device is a 3D Smartphone. Good luck to @AntonYakubenko I also would be very interested in how this can go internationally as I am in Canada. Such as which Smartphones are compatible with your technology?
Post 14 IP   flag post
3rd Party
Service
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
https://patents.justia.com/assignee/matterport-inc

Anton and his small team are a dynamic force that have always looked to do things differently. A large differetiator has been approaching the capture process in a different manner by combining a consumer smart phone with a Structure sensor -- which is similar to the PrimeSense sensor that is found in an array of 3 within the Pro-1 camera -- and as a modified, custom version in the Pro-2 cameras.

I have been concerned that GeoCV's end product replicates Matterport's experience and does not differentiate itself enough. I believe that there will be changes necessary, but I also believe that they have the opportunity to build a stronger, more unique product.

@DanSmigrod

Tesla indeed owns a huge number of patents. All of which are open sourced.

https://www.tesla.com/BLOG/ALL-OUR-PATENT-ARE-BELONG-YOU

It was necessary to open source in order to achieve progress. In the case of Matterport, it is not necessary to open source as they are not trying to solve social / political issues related to an establishment.

--

In the world of consumer cell phone devices, much of the cost associated with the purchase of the device is related to manufacturers licensing patented technology that is necessary to produce a working cell phone.

Patents do not exist to stop other people from using technology. They exist to protect the work of the inventors and it is necessary for them to be reviewed in cases like this.

--


Consider that Matterport's desire to protect their product, the investment in the product and our investment in their product. The lawsuit with GeoCV has larger implications. GeoCV is not, in my opinion, a bad actor. There is potential for bad actors to exist -- copy cats that literally steal the technology and look to undercut what Matterport has established.

Matterport has invested massive amounts of money in marketing and developing relationships to create demand for this type of product. They have invested hundreds of years of human manpower to develop a platform that solves problems never tackled in the industry before. These include simplified on-site registration of point clouds in a consumer electronic device, the ability to instruct rendering software to fill holes in a 3D MESH, and the dynamic of how three fixed views of a 3D space work together with the addition of panoramic imagery. There are quite a few patents that have been filed throughout this entire journey. Many many have been necessary to secure investment capital, many may have simply been necessary for the inventors to feel secure in their time investment.

The Matterport 3D Showcase, Capture App, Camera and all other aspects of the product came from a massive financial investment and massive risk. At this very moment, I suspect that Matterport is still engaged in a large amount of risk and uncertainty and that solving these logistical problems on a daily basis is necessary to continue to provide growth for itself as well as its customers.

Protecting the work that has been done - both technologically and from a business angle makes perfect sense.

--

It would be my hope that GeoCV has the opportunity to continue growth and differentiate itself in a way that satisfies any legal controversy.

From my interactions with GeoCV here on WGAN, on the telephone, via email and in person -- I know that these are some wonderful people who are excited about solving problems, creating new experiences, and building an incredible product. I do not believe that they set out to be the next Matterport, rather, I believe that their ultimate goal is to create a unique product that the marketplace demands.
Post 15 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user



Screen Grabs: Source: Justia Dockets & filings

Hi All,

Anyone know how to retrieve these documents?

Might be nice to read the primary documents filed in in Matterport Inc. versus GeoCV, Inc.

Best,

Dan
Post 16 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user


Screen Grab: Source: PaceMonitor
Post 17 IP   flag post
zsolt private msg quote post Address this user
And finally found!



you can see here the working capture device. Mobile with a simple 3d cam. And this is how the app works or some beta version from 2016



You can find also a couple of processed scan on their facebook page and website. There was almost empty just a couple of weeks ago.
What I can't understand if this is working just like that why not selling the cloud service yet?
Post 18 IP   flag post
3rd Party
Service
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
According to the filing, these are the patents that Matterport is claiming that GeoCV is in violation of:

8,861,840 B2
Identifying and filling holes across multiple aligned three-dimensional scenes
Filed: Oct 14, 2013
Granted: Oct 14, 2014

9,165,410 Bl
Building a three-dimensional composite scene
Filed: Step 17, 2014
Granted: Oct 20, 2015

9,171,405 Bl
Identifying and filling holes across multiple aligned three-dimensional scenes
Application: 09/17/14
Granted: 10/27/15

8,879,828 B2
Capturing and aligning multiple 3-dimensional scenes
Application: 01/03/13
Granted: 11/04/14

9,953,111 B2
Semantic understanding of 3D data
Application: 06/02/25
Granted: 04/24/18

10,030,979 B2
Determining and/or generating a navigation path through a captured three-dimensional model rendered on a device
Application: 05/24/18
Granted: 07/24/18
Post 19 IP   flag post
Premium
Member
hometakes private msg quote post Address this user
So I watched the whole two hour video of Dan and Anton. Law suit aside, I cant help but wonder why Anton wants to be a service provider of his technology. Why is it that he doesn't just focus on producing his technology and selling the technology? Just like Matterport conflicts with MSP's by trying to sell the MSP's clients cameras, your model conflicts with your 3D Open house tour providers as you will be competing with them in the same marketplace. Obviously, you will always be able to sell for less as you own the platform that makes the 3D Tour work.

Anton, I implore you to stick with what you know and are good at, developing 3D Tour solution technology and to stay away from being the provider of your tech to the end user. This is a major reason why so many Matterport Providers would just ship to your platform as they are very upset with Matterport getting to their clients. As was famously said in the Scarface Movie "Don't get high on your own supply" and look what happened to Tony Montana. You dont see Nikon or Canon getting into the taking photos for people business do you?

Am I the only one that feels this way?

P.S. Sell your service with an open platform, do it for less and you will own the market.
Post 20 IP   flag post
zsolt private msg quote post Address this user
There is a difference, the camera (which worth more $1000 than $3000) Maybe GeoCV just have been waiting for this sue and if the legal stuff clear they will get the 3rd round investment to make an international cloudservice.
Post 21 IP   flag post
Gerhard private msg quote post Address this user
Who cares ???

If there is a better tech out there how many MSP will leave Matterport 99% ?

Lets have an honest pole about this.

Dont make GEO CV cheaper than Matterport, becuase its far superior than MP.

Cant wait to bin my Matterport camera soon....
Post 22 IP   flag post
Gerhard private msg quote post Address this user
Do you see GoPro sueing all the other action camera manufacturers? No, they focus on thier product. Matterport thinks they are the Apple of this tech. They need new managementt and very soon becuase they are falling fatser than a rock.
Post 23 IP   flag post
Tette99 private msg quote post Address this user
Should sue 3Dnest.cn
Post 24 IP   flag post
Gerhard private msg quote post Address this user
http://beyond.3dnest.cn/play/?m=zq_pcylgc_13

clickable text
Post 25 IP   flag post
Gerhard private msg quote post Address this user
Wow this is amazing clickable textwonedr what it is going to cost ?
Post 26 IP   flag post
Premium
Member
DannyBasting private msg quote post Address this user
@Tette99 , that is pointless due to the language barrier

Post 27 IP   flag post
Premium
Member
hometakes private msg quote post Address this user
I don't think Matterport has too much to worry about with the camera coming to the US market and trying to steal the US customers away from them. The price of the camera is $3440 and the cost to make a model is $14 each. Quoting from their website "Zhongqu Technology currently has two charging options. One is that the user buys a camera for shooting at a price of 23,800 yuan, and then only needs to pay a 100 yuan fee when generating the model."

If they were selling the camera at $1000 and $5 per model, then I would be seriously worried if I were Matterport.
Post 28 IP   flag post
WGAN
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
Hi All,

Related WGAN Forum Discussion:

✓ Lawsuit: Matterport, Inc. versus GeoCV, Inc. - All Legal Documents

Best,

Dan
Post 29 IP   flag post
PointCloudVR private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonYakubenko
Dear community,

I've been always transparent and responsive on this forum. I would be happy to tell you what's happening behind the scenes with this Matterport complaint but I’m concerned that what I say to you could be misinterpreted and used against us. So I'd like to just assure you that GeoCV is confident in its position as we have spent years and millions dollars of R&D for developing our proprietary solution. GeoCV has its own intellectual property, and GeoCV respects others’ intellectual property. GeoCV will vigorously defend itself against any of Matterport’s claims.
I, for one, am rooting for you!
Post 30 IP   flag post
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