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Capture AppproblemRicoh Theta Z1

Ricoh Theta Z1 used for Matterport Capture: Going Outside Help Please12370

Andy17 private msg quote post Address this user
Hi all. I run both a Pro2 and am just practicing with a Z1. I've had a few mis-placed scans from the Z1 which tells me I have to pay closer attention to alignments, even w/o error messages. But I'm really stumped on how to do a very specific thing. I am visiting a house where there's a sliding glass door out onto a deck (scans 13, 12, 7,8,9,10 are on the deck)

I cannot get the Capture app to connect the dots (lol) from inside to outside, even with the door wide open. I had hoped that this would be easier with the 360 Z1 than the Pro2, but perhaps the weak link is the [Matterport] capture app.

The scans in question are 50, 52, 54 (which is literally in the doorway onto the deck. The next scan I tried was just outside on the little mat you can see to the left of 54. No alignment. The camera is probably less than 12" from the scan 54 yet fails to align. Same for any location near there on the deck. No errors messages for other scans in that area.

The open slider is where the scans mentioned are located. It doesn't matter if I mark the door, or trim sandwich the door. Same result - can't exit.

I had assumed that the issue with going outside with the Pro2 was the IR measurement, which I had also assumed might be integral to the alignment process. But with the Z1, that's not involved.

Any tips? Thank you!

Post 1 IP   flag post
CharlesHH private msg quote post Address this user
I had an outside deck like that recently.
I scanned all the time with the Matterport Pro 2. With the sun I had to make the scans quite close or I got no alignment. The sun was leaving big black holes on the terrace so I did (in my case) three 360 shots which covered the black holes, then converted to a scan with Cortex. It worked perfectly and the three 360's found their correct homes within the regular scans.
Post 2 IP   flag post
castaway private msg quote post Address this user
Hey Andy,

You had done indoor and outdoor scans prior, then just this one messed up? Were scans 3-11 fails or ones you deleted experimentally?

Just starting out with using an Insta but found even from a distance, that the 360 scanning loves to build a big sticky door over even glass doors.

So more than with a Pro or Pro 2, and even though a box of trim can often clear up a mesh obstacle? I'm making sure doors (even glass ones) always seen as open, fwiw.

I know that's not going to help after the fact, esp if you can't get back there. Maybe try making a duplicate and (on the duplicate) delete some (maybe every other? ) of the scans that see the door as closed , then reprocessing, checking it from mesh view in Workshop, etc?

Lots of short distance scans just before and after a threshold from indoor to outdoor. Mark nearby windows from inside and out but no markings over the always open glass door. Outdoors after indoors, but with that said, if trying to pick up a trail from prior scans, start with on right over the closest (scan 2 here), then move forward.


Post 3 IP   flag post
Atriux private msg quote post Address this user
Hi Andy ,

Outside is a different ball game as we know ( weather , nature , space , IR light , people , animals etc ) Software can’t translate right .
You can’t pass because is an invisible wall as a result of a misalignment.
If you took the scan in the spot were is sliding door’s track that’s another bummer... not indicated.
Use Cortex 3D conversion from a 360 pic if you took it or you can go back and approximate the same scenario ( weather , day time , placement of the stuff around ) . If not possible then
Do this test : duplicate the project for a fail safe , move the scans 50,51,52 ,54 In this order on a different “floor “ ( add something ) . Check if all these 4 scans aligning right with their position like in real life
Zoom in the scans ; you can move it back after )
(If not then you need the 360 scans for that area and manually align them ! ) unless you want to do the project again

Check also if were any light reflections / glare
around the door.
Light Reflections are translated as mirrors sometimes .
Was the sliding door open all the time in the scans area ?
That might a factor, too .

Z1 had no infrared issues but
doesn’t have Lidar like MP cams ( that’s why Z1 is not accurate in the measurements for floor plans )
360 -3D conversion will work better .
Also keep In mind Z1 has network deployment in 2.4GHz & 5Ghz
When you move from inside to outside
Z1’s electromagnetic compass is getting messed up , hence the misalignments if you don’t switch it right .
( i find this as a bug in Z1 software ; new firmware might correct it but haven’t tried , yet )

Trial & error seems like a good practice for outside adventures .
Let me know how it goes and good luck .
Post 4 IP   flag post
Andy17 private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you for the thoughtful responses. I have tried it a couple of more times and still have a wall. But I have a theory about why this might be happening, and the clue was the Z1 beep. I am not certain how the Capture app controls the settings on the camera, but I DO know that faster beeps indicates shorter exposures.

So could it be as simple as this: Alignment fails because once outside, the camera is going to UNDER-expose the interior, so cannot easily determine how to align to a now-darkened interior.

I'm not sure I can do it here, but I wonder what would happen if you added a bunch of light to the interior for that first photo outside the slider? Wouldn't that make it more likely to align? Again, this is using the Z1.

I've re-uploaded it again having had a "low overlap" and another scan w/o error just outside that door. If I can muster enough lights in this house I'm staying at, I will try that.

Atriux - I'm not sure what you're suggesting with the 360-3D conversion. If I use a 360 image from just outside the window, is there a way to force that into a scan at a specific location in the mesh? I wasn't aware that was possible. Is this what you're referring to? I'll also check alignment of the other locations, but they navigate just fine until the "wall".

Castaway- the other scans were fine or deleted. In terms of viewing the mesh, I'm not sure what I should be looking for. It's definitely splotchy. The latest re-do that's in process now has all-new scans leading up to that door to make sure it was open and consistent.

Post 5 IP   flag post
Atriux private msg quote post Address this user
Andy ,

Yes . You can force a 360 scan in a mesh and convert it in 3D. However you will need to determine the exact spot and orientations in respect with adjacent scans to align it right. Remove/ delete the bad one and stick new one.
Make sure we have internet connection when you do the conversion ...Cortex works in real time and learns from mistakes if you can’t make it for the first time ; sometimes outputs very subtle hints to help you.
3D scan conversion to 360 scan back is not possible at least for now.
Post 6 IP   flag post
CharlesHH private msg quote post Address this user
I've been using the new 4.02 Capture with Cortex enabled.
So I had all my 360 MP scans on the terrace with regular scanning but black holes on the floor plan.

Then I positioned the camera where it would cover the black areas.
Shot a 360.
Selected the image (bottom right)and then at top - Place on Map. This placed it in top left corner of floor plan. Touch the circular 360 marker and you get 4 choices. Bottom one is Convert to 3D.
Touch that, it converts and then (usually) finds its own correct location on the plan.
Post 7 IP   flag post
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