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CaptureLarge SpacesMatterportPro2

40,000sf into only 2-3 Matterport models. Possible?10491

bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
Hello fellow MSPs. I am told by Matterport support that processing models larger than 200 scans is not only unsupported, but downright hazardous.

I have a client looking for 3D models they intend to import into their CAD software for purposes of creating architectural plans. They want one scan every 4 feet. This means a total of 2,500 scans. But they will not put up with 12-13 models. They want 2, maybe 3.

Is this even possible with a Matterport Pro2? I have read a number of topics here on WGAN that have discussed large models, but because things change over time, I just wanted to reach out to the community and ask for a bit of guidance on this.

Thanks to all in advance!
Post 1 IP   flag post
lilnitsch private msg quote post Address this user
My largest to date was a church that came in at 563 scan positions 1 model scanned on the Pro2 (approx 50,000 or so SqFt). I haven't done the Matterpacks

I think 2 to 3 should be plausible but, someone with more Matterpack knowledge my chime in with more real world info
Post 2 IP   flag post
lilnitsch private msg quote post Address this user
If you do not already have a tripod dolly I'd get one it really comes in handy on the larger areas
Post 3 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@lilnitsch Thanks for the insight. 50K SF in 563 scans - about 1 scan per 89sf. These guys want 1 scan every 4 feet, which works out to be one in every 16sf! Plus, all 40,000sf is on one level, so tough to sort out where to break from one model to the next.

So, it may not be the size of the space, but rather the density of scans. According to MP documentation, they claim as many issues with not enough overlap to too much overlap as being chief reasons for alignment errors.

I can't imagine doing 13,000+sf (1/3 the size of the entire space) only to find out I have issues and now have to back up and create a 2nd model. That said, I gotta get some feedback from the pros who know these huge spaces.

Tripod dolly? Amen!
Post 4 IP   flag post
WGAN Forum
Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott

Would the client accept the following?

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In the event that Matterport is unable to process the two models - or if the Matterport Capture App is unable to add more scan points - client agrees that you can duplicate the model and submit it as smaller models?

Since the client is ultimately going to use the Matterport MatterPak to CAD - and they can combined the models in CAD - perhaps this would be an acceptable compromise?

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Dan
Post 5 IP   flag post
lilnitsch private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott
Post 6 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@DanSmigrod Though I do not know how complicated it is to combine the models in CAD, if any other MSP would run into similar issues, I can't imagine why this sort of disclaimer/disclosure wouldn't be acceptable.

My sense is that this client has had similar work done on many different projects using operators who use Matterport cameras. As such, their frame of reference is based on experience, so on some level, I am deferring to them that it is possible to so 2,500 scans in 2-3 spaces to begin with.

I appreciate the creative thinking Dan!
Post 7 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@lilnitsch Nice tripod! I wonder if they make them with larger wheels (for carpet)?
Post 8 IP   flag post
lilnitsch private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott They do, it's just a tripod dolly I picked this one as I primarily shoot residential properties and this base fits through doorways
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott

You might ask them what their experience has been with these super-large Matterport spaces since they have engaged Matterport Pros in other markets too.

Best,

Dan
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott




I this tripod dolly. [I recall that it comes in two wheel sizes]

I should have gotten a tripod dolly five years a go!

Wow! So, So, So much easier to do large open spaces. I can't imagine using one in a house with furniture and carpet, but a basketball court? Perfect!

I will write the week of 21 October 2019 about doing a Matterport scan of a basketball court: what I learned/challenges, etc.

Best,

Dan

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Dolica LT-D100 Professional Lightweight Tripod Dolly

Gear of the Week: Dolica LT-D100 Professional Lightweight Tripod Dolly

Hi All,

I am scheduled to do a test shoot of a basketball court this Friday (17 October 2019). If the job goes forward, it will be nearly 50,000 SQ FT - three full-size basketball courts, fitness center, spa-area, dining area and reception.

I bought the Dolica LT-D100 Professional Lightweight Tripod Dolly to make the shoot go faster and easier (and reduce stress on the tripod and my back ). (The dolly will be particularly helpful, if I have to shoot the basketball court at two levels: lowest height with the Matterport Pro 3D Camera (just to be successful scanning) and then at normal camera level (for the walk around experience). [I will hide the "low scans" in Matterport Workshop 3.0.

Since the basketball court is a big, open space, I have some concerns about whether I can successfully scan it (without adding targets or objects). If I can not scan at normal eye-level, I do feel that I will be successful lowering the camera to the lowest tripod setting (since the camera may be able to "see" the floor better). That said, I offered our client a test shoot first.

Thus, I may need to scan the basketball court twice. And, any time I spend scanning is down time for the use/rental of the basketball court. So, I would like to be able to do this basketball court fast! Particularly, if I will need to scan all three basketball courts and the rest of the spaces.

To make the project even more complex, I will be testing if I can successfully add 10 basketball players using either the Matterport Pro 3D Camera and/or Insta360 One X. I may have to use the Matterport Pro 3D Camera to do a series of scans to get close to the players and hide the extra scans.

While I would love to add a Leica BLK360 to the mix to get scan data of the super-high ceiling, client and I discussed that the expense of getting the dollhouse view to look amazing was not worth the expense (good enough is okay).

I will let you know next week how it goes with this tripod dolly next week.

Which tripod dolly are you using for wide open spaces and what's been your experience been with your dolly?

Best,

Dan











Dolica LT-D100 Professional Lightweight Tripod Dolly

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Post 11 IP   flag post
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Founder
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@bryanhscott

I could imagine that sophisticated buyer has you upload the Matterport models to their Matterport Cloud account. If that's the case, it would be their problem if it does not process. (They then could duplicate the model to make smaller models, and process, etc. ...)

Does the client want you to upload to their Matterport Cloud account?

Dan
Post 12 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@DanSmigrod @lilnitsch Thanks to you both for the additional info on the tripod dolly. I'm also going to add an electric cart to my tool list ;-)

I might add that even if there isn't an economically-priced dolly with larger wheels, the way they attach (from the picture) makes it seem quite easy to just "adapt," separately purchased dolly wheels from a 3rd party.

@DanSmigrod Regarding the question of this particular client's experience with very large spaces, yes, I did ask directly and was told, "...this has not been an issue." But, I am also reminded of the Reagan Theory of Operation, "Trust Buy Verify," which is why I value your comment about the "What if" disclaimer just in case. Thx again.
Post 13 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@DanSmigrod My Matterport account, or theirs? Nice catch Dan! That issue did not occur to me, but I will clarify with the client for sure. Thanks for your observation.
Post 14 IP   flag post
PolyCan private msg quote post Address this user
On a similar note, (for size) I was asked to bid on a 40k square foot project. I listed all the value and free addons I was giving this company for the upcoming larger scan bid as well as the previous 6 scans I had done for them, for what I believe was below market value since I am just starting out. (thank you, Dan, for the billing lessons in the WGAN training)

After I submitted my preferred billing that did have a lot of discounts, so I thought. They ended up asking if I would further discount it to something that would work out to 2¢ a sqft? Now for a scan that's about 40k is that normal? Or are they totally taking advantage of new MSPs? Because they did give me (what I am thinking is likely a story now) about why they are looking for a new MSP. Which was that their current MSP is out of the country and not available to do the scans. I feel that they are going with the lowest possible scanning prices. I do not want to be in a race to the bottom of the barrel, and lower my standards to what I feel is a fair price. Is anything below 5¢ / sqfoot ridiculous? I would think so.

Thoughts?
Post 15 IP   flag post
lilnitsch private msg quote post Address this user
@PolyCan On larger spaces I typically revert to a daily rate rather than by the foot plus any travel expenses if necessary.
Post 16 IP   flag post
bryanhscott private msg quote post Address this user
@PolyCan I see you are in Denver. Any chance that the 40,000sf job you are referring to is in Lone Tree for IFTI?

Either way, $.02psf?! Does they want that to include processing and Matterpak costs as well?
Post 17 IP   flag post
Expertise private msg quote post Address this user
HI Dan... I look forward to hearing about the basketball project. We did a somewhat similar space, a car museum about a year ago. It was basically a nightmare. The space was very same/same. It has super tall ceilings, and endless rows of cars that all look pretty much the same to the Matterport. The walls are also same same. It was very frustrating, with the MP sometimes eating up nice sized chucks of space happily, and then suddenly spitting scans back at us for no apparent reason.
Here is one section (we ended up breaking it into 3 pieces)...

American Muscle car Museum
Post 18 IP   flag post
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