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Dan's Brain Teaser #3 - The Perfect Storm817

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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
Hi All,

1.

Why did scans continued to fail at the top of these stairs and how did I solve this challenge today? (Sunday, 18 October 2015).

2. Bonus ...

What are (at least) two ways to solve this challenge?

3. Bonus ...

Why did I do the harder of the two ways? (Two reasons)

Ready? Go!

Dan


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crullier private msg quote post Address this user
because you are the a Chief Photographer and want to push the limits of the tech !!

post the end product.
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cdpmedia private msg quote post Address this user
All I know is that I cant wait to hear the answers and I hope I can continue to avoid extreme conundrums on the job sites.
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Tosolini private msg quote post Address this user
I'll take a guess: the glass below the handrails will create problems with the scanning, so you need to elevate the scanner to recognize objects above the handrails. Maybe hanging some pictures or something on the white wall would help too. Am I following the right path? :-)
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Jamie private msg quote post Address this user
I'm guessing the refraction of the scan through the glass.

To solve. A can of spray paint on the glass, or start upstairs first and work your way down. I like option 1 best though
Mark the glass as a mirror or window.

Why? You are bored with easy scans and have time to burn???
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alx3D private msg quote post Address this user
Definitely with the others thinking not only the glass but the reflective metal handrail and the monotonous white wall to the right and the stairs that each look the same makes it hard for the software to tell where it is at.

I would take my farthest scan and set it on another floor, next I would continue to scan on that floor. This way with the new processing the program will only look at places relative to the last scan to place the new scan rather than the whole model.

Something to break up the visual field (like spray paint or pictures) and also reflects the IR (not glass or shiny metal or some plastics {maybe those stairs didn't pick the IR like microwave or refrigerator faces}) would help but is not always the most practical.
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jessetutt private msg quote post Address this user
The window wall caused issued. You can either elevate your camera or shoot closer scenes and then delete them once they are connected. You shot closer and deleted since it works without changing the height?
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mikeE private msg quote post Address this user
My first scan with my new Matterport camera was a 5400sq ft mountain home that gave me a similar challenge. I could not get the transition scan from the 3rd floor to the 4th floor. I tried, scanning one step at a time, i tried scanning at multiple heights, i tried overlapping the previous floor by several steps, i tried moving some shiny objects that i thought might be throwing off the scan, i tried waiting until the exterior light returned to cloudy since the staircase was surrounded by windows and in the middle of the shoot it went from dreary to sunny... I was stumped!! then my wife suggested that I tilt the camera back about 20 degrees a few steps down and see if that changed anything. I thought that sounded absurd so i resisted. finally I tried it and then moved the camera all the way to the top step and leveled the camera out. That worked. I don't know why or how or if I'm on crazy pills but she is not likely to let me forget that it was her idea :P
I'm sure that is not how the master did it and I can't wait to hear the right way to do it, because i was ready to sell the camera after my first attempt.
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Jamie private msg quote post Address this user
Don't give up @mike
You will run into lots of challenges. Well done starting on such a large property as well. Talk about jumping in the deep end.
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mikeE private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks Jamie. I started a new thread for critiques of my first scan.
Here is the thread:
http://forum.we-get-around.com/topic/827/newby---1st-scan-critique/

and here is the showcase:
https://my.matterport.com/show/?m=e7STzJ9DXA6
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@crullier Thanks
@cdpmedia My pain; your gain.
@Tosolini you are headed in the right direction, but why? Hanging new pictures at the hotel? Do I leave them there?
@Jamie I'm sure the hotel would love for me to spray-paint; the time I spend and why is for another thread post.
@alx3D Always spot on though spray-paint and hanging pictures may not go over well with our hotel client ...though, not sure what the following means or how it works. Can you explain please?Quote:
Originally Posted by @alx3D
...I would take my farthest scan and set it on another floor, next I would continue to scan on that floor. This way with the new processing the program will only look at places relative to the last scan to place the new scan rather than the whole model.

@jessetutt good partial answer
@mikeE 20 degrees? Hmmmm. Can't image, but if I run into trouble, I'lll give it a try. BTW, no life without wife. Selling your camera on eBay is fine. See this thread. I could use the $49.95.

I will answer soon

I am still busy with capture this week of this luxury boutique hotel in NYC. Long days (and nights).

Best,

Dan
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
Okay, let's see how you did ...

1. Why did scans continued to fail at the top of these stairs and how did I solve this challenge today? (Sunday, 18 October 2015).

Answer. As I understand it, the Matterport Pro 3D Camera takes 3 images every 60 degrees and then looks for common points to stitch the 18 images together. The images overlap. So, the same book, for example, will show up in multiple images that can be recognized as common points.

Challenges for the camera include:

a. Walls that have no picture frames or other art
b. Glass
c. Floors that do not have patterns
d. Direct sunlight
e. banisters (polished like mirrors for our capture)

The perfect storm on these stairs: walls without pictures; glass, floors that do not have patterns (shined up for our capture). While I did not have direct sunlight on the steps, I was pro-active about when to capture the steps to avoid direct sunlight.

Unfortunately, adding picture frames and spray painting where not options at this luxury boutique hotel. Plus, even if I could add objects that would add common points to the space (for the floor plan and dollhouse views only), it's likely to have taken longer to accomplish this than the following (and I needed both levels scanned before 'magic hour' lighting (more on that in a moment).

2. Bonus ...

What are (at least) two ways to solve this challenge?

While I first tried 'baby steps' - moved the Camera 6 includes - that did not work. So, I then lowered the Camera (at this point, I am only scanning for the dollhouse and floor plan views and disable these scans anyway. The combination of 'baby steps' and lowering the camera to its lowest point worked.

3. Bonus ...

Why did I do the harder of the two ways? (Two reasons)


When I shoot - especially in a space that has double-high floor glass around - I am constantly thinking about 'magic hour' lighting (the last hour before sunset. For the Matterport Camera, I might also get a half-hour after sunset.)

So, it was critical that I scan the stairs when the sunlight would not hit it so that I could get both floors done. Typically, all the scans are never for the walk around experience. Instead, they are for:

a. dollhouse view
b. floor plan view
c. creating a great mesh (for VR)

So, I plan the capture to be "done" by one hour before sunset. Then I add only the scans for the 'walk around' view and 'VR' view (which can be different). I think about where I want the viewer to stand and walk and even "when" ... So, for example, in a two-story loaf shoot, I wanted (amazing) views outside the loft bedroom windows to be closer to nighttime for some extra drama and the living room views to be what you would expect to see.

Sometimes, for this project for example, I have enough time to shoot "magic hour" twice. The first time is the "safety" to make sure I got a great model. The second time around is to see if I can push it to better views outside the windows.

It's more art that science. And, after you do it a ton, you know when it will look great outside the windows.

By the way, I always begin a capture with my compass app. I care a lot about where the sun is and where it is going.

While we can not control the F-stop, shutter speed or ISO on the camera, we CAN control light by where we scan when.

Yes. It's a bit obsessive, BUT I treat every shoot like artwork. And, yes, I can take eight hours to shoot 1,200 sf.

When you look at the Matterport 3D Showcase for this post (I will likely added it next week), I want you to say, 'Wow! I want to stay there.' (And, how did he get the outdoor lighting to look so great and how did he manage to keep the camera out of all the mirrors.

It's (very) hard work to make it look so easy.

Now you know some of my magic

I hope you enjoyed this Brain Teaser and find the 'what I did' and 'why I did' helpful.

Got a technique that you would like to share, start a new thread post.

Best,

Dan
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mikeE private msg quote post Address this user
Great ideas Dan. Thank you.
How do you balance the artificial light indoors with the perfect exterior light?
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cdpmedia private msg quote post Address this user
Dan, As always, thanks for taking the time and effort to share with and educate all of us with your expertise. Awesome stuff, cant wait to see the model.
Chris
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@cdpmedia Thank you ...

Here's the Matterport 3D Showcase model that inspired this Brain Teaser thread.

Dan

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