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Alternative for confidential tours - CUPIX5377

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Snap private msg quote post Address this user
Hi everyone,

I am a fairly new Matterport SP and had recently been approached by a client who requires a virtual tour for their equipment. The problem is that it’s proprietary and Matterport owns the rights to any data scanned in their tours and there's really no way to keep the tours private. I am looking for alternatives so I started looking into 360 cameras and hosting platforms. The problem is that most of the virtual tour hosting sites create a point A to point B tours, not the seemless walk-through experience you would get with Matterport tours.

I came across CUPIX virtual tour hosting platform and I think it has a lot of potential to fill a void here. Unlike the other hosting sites I’ve come across, they are focused on a more seemless walk-through experience which requires a different way of scanning. For example you need to scan indoors every 3 steps (6’/2m), every 5 footsteps outdoors, and scanning before / on / after entryways. They are currently in BETA testing right now but are planning a major release / update in October with BETA ending around that time.

I reached out to CUPIX and had the opportunity to have a web meeting with one of their representatives – [redacted]. He has been very responsive to my inquiries and the company seems very open to user feedback so I suggest you reach out too if you have any suggestions. I have sent [redacted] a link to this post so he will be keeping tabs and chiming in on any questions you may have.

The main points I’d like to mention that they will be offering:

-Seemless walk-though experience
-The ability to send all the data – including the virtual tour to your clients to have on file that can be used OFF-LINE. This means we will not have to rely on third party sites for this data so if anything say happened to CUPIX in the future, data would not be lost. This would also keep sensitive information private and the tours can be viewed in remote locations with no internet connection.
-Can incorporate interactive floorplans
-Creates a 3D Mesh of your scan in point cloud format (He was going to talk to the developers if there was any possibility of turning it into a dollhouse configuration)
-Unlimited pano images per tour
-Embedding videos directly into the tours
-Total ownership of your scan data
-White label / own branding options
-Measuring option right in the tour
-Collaborator option
-‘Mattertag’ like content anchor / pushpin option with different colors with the ability to add links, embed videos etc.

This is something to keep on your radar this fall if you’re like me, looking for a way to accommodate clients with sensitive information. [redacted], let me know if I got anything wrong and feel free to chime in on anything I missed.

www.cupix.com
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aerialpixels private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks for sharing @snap

Yea, the thing about matterport owning it and being on clound and all the grey IP areas makes things a pain for some of the larger clients who are keen on the tech. MP I hope u are reading this.

Anyways, I went to look at what Cupix is doing.
TBH it still feels far from MP and that seamless walkthru flow isnt there.
To me the main killer feature of MP is it is really 3d and we get the dollhouse to play around, and 3d floorplans too.

Hope Cupix can give MP a run for their money.
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TrustedPhotoDC private msg quote post Address this user
Interesting - I signed up for the beta. Looks like straight forward photogrammetry in the cloud. Realviz Stitcher and Image Modeler (purchased by Autodesk in 2008) was doing this on the desktop a decade ago, using 360 photospheres to speedup workflow. This is video, but you could create 3d models and walk-throughs.

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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi Snap,
Thanks for the time it was great connecting with you for earlier this week and covering some of your questions. Having just now gained approval to create a WGAN profile I'm now able to respond and you certainly took a lot of notes during our call which is great.

What you've posted is accurate regarding ownership, confidentiality, and offline viewing:

- Yes, All data you upload to Cupix belongs to the account holder. Cupix assumes no ownership of your data.
- Yes, You and only you control sharing. You can choose to publish your 3D Tour (i.e.: URL/embed to Cupix Player of your Tour) or your can share your 3D Tour with collaborators (i.e.: User invite to Cupix Editor for your Tour). Otherwise your data remains entirely private.
- Yes, You can save your Cupix 3D Tour for offline viewing. Your tour can be hosted offline on any private server and someone viewing their tour never has to touch the cloud to access their 3D Tour. Note: we'll make this feature will become generally available in late October [2017].

In your post you made a couple of other points regarding the general features and workflow in Cupix, like a fully white-label player and editor (customizable logos and branding), being able to use any 360/VR camera, being able to generate a 3D mesh (which is automatic) and being able underlay a floor plan to the 2D plan view (also automatic), among others.

Aside from confidentiality, ownership and offline viewing, which of these Cupix capabilities has the biggest impact for you?
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @TrustedPhotoDC,
The video you posted is great and there's some careful curation and planning that went into the video walkthrough. And you are right, Cupix software does use photogrammetry to create 3D tours, but it's important to point out a few important differences and challenges that Cupix has overcome:

- Cupix provides automatic 3D scene generation. Upload your VR/360 photos and get a 3D tour. This is the only required step. You don't need to match each photo to the next like you would in general purpose photogrammetry software. In Cupix registration is automatic and done in the cloud.

- Cupix excels with low-resolution, entry level 360 cameras. Off the shelf VR/360 cameras like the Ricoh Theta line of cameras can be used in place of panorama rigs which will often capture a gigapixels worth of data (either type of photo is compatible with Cupix). Cupix can work with the best AND worst of 360 photos to create a 3D tour, and in particular the low-resolution low-quality input has been a challenging problem that Cupix has overcome to create 3D tours.

- Cupix has been expressly built to automatically create and share interactive 3D Tours from 360 photos. The focus is very specific: make it easy to upload, make 3D tour creation fully automatic, make it easy to customize items like floorplans/tags/highlights, and make it easy to share. Features upcoming in Cupix future product releases ... 4D tours, enterprise site data management, 360 Video support as input, etc. ... reinforce the same goal: fast, shareable and easy to create 3D Tours.

So, after doing a little research on the Salzburg Museum Video posted, I was not surprised to discover that this was not an overnight project. It probably took closer to a few weeks / month to create. While the tour is immersive, it requires a totally different level of effort compared to Cupix or Matterport to create a tour. I have been a power-user of Geomagic (a 3D scanning software) and appreciate the power and flexibility that comes with a high-octane PC and high-powered software. But with the power comes a steep learning curves, and putting a 3D tour on the web for sharing is no easy task if you are using desktop software to create the tour. So general purpose software like this one from Autodesk is a simply a different type of ballgame.

In light of the time and effort that can go into a tour depending on the input, scope and deliverable, what factors do you consider when determining how much effort should go into creating a tour?
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Snap private msg quote post Address this user
Thank you @scott_cupix. To answer your question a more seamless walk-through experience. What most are also looking for is the dollhouse view but Matterport is the only one who can provide this feature at the moment. Have you had an opportunity to find out if Cupix will be able to create these as well?
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aerialpixels private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @TrustedPhotoDC @scott_cupix

That vid of the Salzberg museum...unless I am outdated (I could be),
the 3D geometry of the mesh looks way too clean and 'intelligent' to have been automatically created.

I posted about this sometime ago
http://forum.we-get-around.com/topic/1971/obj-file-need-some-help/

Scans and photogrammetry to 3D needs some serious AI to come up with such clean usable 3D geometry.

Scott: Any indication of how your 3D geometry and textuuring looks like?
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @aerialpixels and @snap,
You can check out this video to get an idea of the mesh and point cloud that we are creating in Cupix from 360 photos. I've done it myself and @PetraSoderling (Blue-Sketch) is taking a look to confirm that the mesh is plenty good to create a 2D Floor Plan. And we're about to release an update to the geometry engine which provides more enhancements. Here's that video:



Jump to minute 0:58 to get a glimpse of a mesh or ping me and I'll provide a share.


CUPIX Software Update -- ARRIVING SOON
We'll see a CUPIX software update is coming soon. The update will provide a higher quality 3D mesh that impact the Editor and Player. I'm very eager for development to get my hands on it. I expect to have a first look this weekend. [30 Sept./1 Oct. 2017]
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user



Sounds like we need to get a few of us to road test and do some A/B tests. I'm up for it.
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @metroplex, if you want to take a close look a the mesh, I'd suggest you wait until the next release of the geometry engine. I'll post something on WGAN Forum when it's available and that update is right around the corner.

However, if you just want a 3D tour, Cupix is doing this now: Just upload 360° photos to Cupix and you'll get a 3D tour.

This actually that reminds me that @DanSmigrod made a Cupix tour during Hurricane Irma. Here's Dan's 1st Cupix 3D tour: matterport-platform-versus-open-platforms.
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
@scott_cupix - When 3D tours* are available, I'd like to do a comparative tour using both Matterport Pro-2 and Ricoh Theta S using Cupix.

I did see Dan's tour -- I believe your platform can show spots on the ground for navigation -- whereas his tour does't have those on and is a bit cumbersome to navigate as you have to jump one pano at a time.
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@Metroplex360

Chris, that was my fist CUPIX and I made the mistake of shooting a 360º every two-three feet. If I used every other 360º, the walk around experience would be much better.

I did the example while staying in a hotel during IRMA ... (I checked in before my wife so that I would be able to shoot the hotel suite just as any guest would expect.)

I look forward to your Matterport Pro2 V Rich Theta S using CUPIX. (Reminder to shoot Theta with HDR. That said, Ricoh now has a 4K generation which would be a better Pro2 versus Ricoh/Theta comparison.

Best

Dan
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
@DanSmigrod Cupix is absolutely stunning. I just processed a 110 pano tour and the results are mind blowing. Cupix is clearly a winner and a platform that I will be using when Matterport Showcase lacks features needed by a client.

I will share more later, but my test today [28 September 2017] was pretty eye opening. The photogrametry technology is excellent and I have only seen this sort of accuracy in the old Google Business View system.

Can I invest??!
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@Metroplex360

Looking forward to seeing your 110 pano tour example.

Best,

Dan
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
@DanSmigrod - You get to via PM. I'll do a different tour for here
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Helen private msg quote post Address this user
@Metroplex360 Looking forward to see an example from you
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
@Helen - I'll PM you for now The one I did is confidential to the client.
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
Cupix

[cupix]https://players.cupix.com/p/J5JfPtw1[/cupix]
https://players.cupix.com/p/J5JfPtw1

Matterport Showcase


https://my.matterport.com/show/?m=X5aZhUWuyEo

Google Street View


https://goo.gl/maps/hybUw1emGN22

--

Notes:

1. All images captured on a Matterport Pro-2 Camera.
2. 360 Snapshots are better than Ricoh Theta S pictures.
3. Mini Map in Cupix created from a Matterport Snapshot.
4. [cupix] is not a valid WGA shortcode, but should be.
5. GSV was set to face the same direction... but you know how that goes. Always points north.
6. Matterport + Cupix = Fast Loading.
7. GSV = Very embarrasingly slow. [opinion self-redacted]

Now you can make a tour just like this!
1. Export all Matterport Panos using 360 Snapshots
2. Upload panos to Cupix
3. Upload floorplan to other host that provides a link
4. When tour finishes processing, set start location and link the floorplan and scale to fit panos.

Benefits: Alternate Platform.

Need GSV?
1. Export all Matterport Panos using 360 Snapshots
2. Upload panos to GoThru.co
3. Manually position and join panos in moderator.
4. Publish.

Benefits: Perceived value.
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DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user
@Metroplex360

Great proof of concept to show what is possible.

Anyone else try CUPIX yet? (Free while in beta testing).

Dan
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Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user
I would encourage other forum members to check it out.

I want to encourage @scott_cupix to continue with the amazing product that they are building. The automatic positioning and linking of panoramas is a magical feature. I cannot wait to see the platform grow and mature.
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PointCloudVR private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanSmigrod
@Metroplex360

Great proof of concept to show what is possible.

Anyone else try CUPIX yet? (Free while in beta testing).

Dan
I'm signing up and testing today. We have a 2017 gear 360 and a xiaomi sphere 360 that take pretty decent pictures. Excited to say the least!
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PointCloudVR private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metroplex360
I would encourage other forum members to check it out.

I want to encourage @scott_cupix to continue with the amazing product that they are building. The automatic positioning and linking of panoramas is a magical feature. I cannot wait to see the platform grow and mature.
I agree with you . My mind started racing the first time I saw the examples.
@scott_cupix keep up the great work !!!
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FurnitureScanner private msg quote post Address this user
Is it just me or can you not sign up for the site? You click on sign up and it takes you to a login screen, no option to sign up.
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @FurnitureScanner,

To signup you can use your LinkedIn or Facebook account to get access while we're in beta at https://editor.cupix.com/.

Or, PM me and I'll create an account for you based only on your email address.
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Snap private msg quote post Address this user
@scott_cupix

Will the 3D mesh be integrated into the virtual tours with the new update similar to what Matterport has with the dollhouse view?
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
@Snap, I can tell you the 3D that we are generating in the tours is pretty good from what I've seen on the development team's examples (I come from the 3D scanning world, and I'm impressed), and that we'll have an update around the corner.
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ungeherr private msg quote post Address this user
Wow, I didn't know the 360 images were this good from the Matterport 2 camera. Which isn't strange considering how bad the image quality looks when viewed through their own platform.

GSV definitely wins in image quality and maybe that's why they have the slowest loading time.

Cupix delivers the best mix of loading time and image quality.

@scott_cupix Your facebook page mentioned two months ago that you will support multi resolution. Does the demo Metroplex360 posted utilize multi resolution?

Do you believe you can do something more to reach the image quality of GSV and still have a decent loading time?

You can of course not control the loading time on the user end if they have a slow connection but the loading should be about the same on a fast connection no matter the quality if your servers are fast enough.
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @ungeherr,

Cupix is using a CDN which is a common approach for providing high speed content delivery across a worldwide network (Content Delivery Network). The very first time you load a tour will be the slowest for your geographical region. The next time you load it up it will be much faster for you and anyone else in your geographical region. The high speed performance will persist for a few days so long as someone in your geographical region is accessing the Cupix tour. The way this works as you might imagine is that the tour data gets duplicated where it's needed, for example São Paulo, Brazil. So long as someone is accessing the tour every so often in this region, the data stays there and anyone in the region continues to have high speed access to the tour.

This means if you're providing a tour for someone in your geographical region, they will have a high-performance experience since you would be creating and editing the walkthrough for publication from that same region, so it would be fast the very first time your customer loaded the data.

We currently have multi-resolution support. The resolution displayed is either Low, Medium, or High (full resolution). If you are working with a slow internet connection this is an advantage because you can get immediate visualization of the walkthrough without waiting for the highest resolution image to load. The resolution will increase from low to high, until the highest resolution image is loaded into your browser.

Upcoming updates to the Cupix software front end performance will further improve loading time as well as a number of other items which I think the forum will find exciting. But as I mentioned, based on our CDN infrastructure approach it should be quite fast for you right now, and we'd love to hear if it is otherwise or is not as expected.

Thanks
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ungeherr private msg quote post Address this user
Hi Scott and thanks for your thorough answer.

CDN sounds great and I'm sure that your multi res will deliver the best combination of speed and image quality. I'm really excited about Cupix.

With that said, GSV still shows that it's possible to get even higher quality and I wonder if Cupix will try and achieve the same quality of if you don't think it's worth it because of the slower speed?

Thanks
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scott_cupix private msg quote post Address this user
Hi @ungeherr,
Good catch! If you zoom in very tightly then I can see the difference. Let me check with the dev team on why we are imposing this artificial limit on photo resolution. It may be because we never expected anyone to zoom in so tightly. This is simply an implementation decision and if users want to see the full detail then we'll make it so.
Thanks,
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